Panabas, aka Bruticus Maximus... - Page 2

VANDOO · 29th March 2005, 04:08 AM

IF THE PANABAS EVOLVED FROM A TOOL IT WOULD HAVE BEEN SOMETHING USED LIKE AN AXE TO CUT HARD WOOD , BAMBOO OR RATTAN AS IT WOULD HAVE BEEN TOO LARGE AND HEAVY TO CUT LIKE A SICKLE.
AS TO ITS PRESENCE IN PICTURES OF HIGH RANKING DATU'S I SUSPECT THE DATU HAD ALL THE MEN PRESENT NECESSARY TO HOLD COURT AT ALL SUCH FUNCTIONS. WHEN A DATU HELD COURT IT WAS OFTEN TO DETERMINE GUILT OR INNOCENCE IN SOME SERIOUS MATTER SO EXECUTION WAS ALWAYS POSSIBLE, SO A EXECUTIONER WAS PROBABLY ALWAYS PRESENT. THERE WERE NO LEGNTHLY SERIES OF APPEALS AND A SENTENCE OF DEATH WAS OFTEN CARRIED OUT IMEDIATELY. THE PANABAS WOULD HAVE BEEN A SYMBOL OF ATHORITY AND A TOOL OF EXECUTION. MOSTLY CONJECTURE HERE BUT IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO SEE A LIST OF THE PEOPLE AND THEIR FUNCTIONS IN A DATU'S COURT. I NOTICE A OBJECT TO THE RIGHT IN THE GROUP PICTURE THAT HAS A SMALL HANDLE AND IS CLOTH COVERED WHAT IS IT?
SOME VERY NICE PANABAS , I AM JEALOUS

Spunjer · 29th March 2005, 04:31 AM

i believe it's an umbrella...

Federico · 29th March 2005, 05:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

i believe it's an umbrella...

We must go to the same church, cause I believe its a Royal Umbrella as well

Vandoo good conjecture there. A good description on the actual mechanics of a Datu's duty is in Kiefer's anthropoligical work The Tausug. Though a case study done in the 1960s, it is very consistent with more historical observations from the 19th century and earlier. Beyond executional purposes, a strong display of potential violence (at least according to what I remember from Kiefer) was the visual display of a Datu's muscle, so to speak, to enforce his decisions if there was any opposition (since they were likely armed as well), as well as the legitimacy of his rule by the strength and well equiped status of his followers/body guards.

zamboanga · 29th March 2005, 07:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

i believe it's an umbrella...

hmmm... could it be it's official carrier is the person at the left?

Spunjer · 29th March 2005, 03:30 PM

Quote:

hmmm... could it be it's official carrier is the person at the left?

LOL!

on a serious note tho, i wish we could get a better view of the kampilan (man in the foreground). is it just me or does the handle seems to have some metal decorations on it? either way, another fine moro weapon...

Federico · 29th March 2005, 04:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spunjer

LOL!

on a serious note tho, i wish we could get a better view of the kampilan (man in the foreground). is it just me or does the handle seems to have some metal decorations on it? either way, another fine moro weapon...

Did alotta squinting, staples?

VANDOO · 29th March 2005, 07:53 PM

MOST OF THE PEOPLE IN THE PICTURE SEEM TO BE WATCHING SOMETHING, PERHAPS ENTERTAINMENT, PUNISHMENT, PRESENTATIONS? (NO COULDN'T BE PRESENTATIONS AS NO ONE IS SLEEPING

) THE GUY TO THE LEFT SEEMS TO BE THE ONLY ONE TO SHOW HE FINDS THE WHOLE THING AMUSING. I FIND PHILLIPHINO AND MORO PEOPLE HAVE A GOOD SENSE OF HUMOR ALTHOUGH IT IS NOT OFTEN SHOWN AT OFFICIAL OR SERIOUS BUSINESS.
A UMBRELLA HAD CROSSED MY MIND BUT I WAS THINKING STRANGE HILT RATHER THAN ORNATE UMBERLLA TIP, ROYAL UMBRELLAS ARE COMMON IN S.E. ASIA SO THAT IS MOST LIKELY.

Spunjer · 29th March 2005, 11:17 PM

fred,

the dam* picture is now my wallpaper, how can i miss? LOL

Bill · 29th March 2005, 11:32 PM

that picture may simply be the results of the phenomena that happens in the Philippines, whenever a camera is raised, there will always be at least 20 people posing.

Bill · 29th March 2005, 11:37 PM

boxing exhibition?

Federico · 29th March 2005, 11:56 PM

Ughh...I have a caption for the pic somewhere, but I cant remember what book its in. But essentially Governor Taft is visiting Datu Uto (while Datu Uto retained the title of Datu rather than claim the title of Sultan for political reasons, in the last half of the 19th century he was by right and power pretty much Sultan of Buayan), and for some reason I want to say they are watching a bull-fight, but I cant remember. If Mabagani sees this thread I am sure he will remember the caption. Anyways, this is very early on into America's colonization of PI, as Datu Uto dies shortly after from a tropical disease (I believe it may have been from a cholera epidemic or was it Malaria I have his bio buried under a pile of other books, but am too lazy right now to dig). Oh well...

Spunjer for all our joking, why do I have the feeling the guy on the left could probably kick all our A$$es without breaking a sweat.

Anyways, just dont focus too much on him, remember the pretty weaponry as well

Ian · 30th March 2005, 12:21 AM

Guys:

The picture of the assembled Moro dignitaries is dominated by the two Americans in white and I am really surprised that an immigrant to the U.S. is the one to point out that the rotund gentleman in the center of the picture is William Howard Taft, then Governor of the Philippines and later President of the United States. Taft had left the Philippines by 1904, and from 1904-1908 he was supervising the construction of the Panama Canal.

The other distinguished gentleman in white is Major General Leonard Wood, Governor of Moro Province and later Army Chief of Staff under President Taft. Wood was only in the Philippines briefly, serving as Governor of Moro Province from 1903-1906, during which time he commanded U.S. troops in putting down a Moro rebellion in 1904. I believe the photograph dates from 1903-1904, when both Taft and Wood were in the Philippines.

Because the Moro in this picture are carrying weapons in close proximity to the distinguished U.S. administrators, it was probably taken before the Moro uprising that was put down by Wood. So I would guess the picture dates from 1903.

Very interesting picture.

Ian.

In the time I was posting my message, Federico beat me to the ID of Taft.

Conogre · 30th March 2005, 01:19 AM

BUT he's too young to possibly know that he was later President Taft (maybe anyways).
An immigrant, by the way,Ian, is THE logical person to be aware of such fantastic information/trivia as many to most Americans have little interest in our own history.
Perhaps because there is so little of it? **grin**
Mike

29th March 2005, 04:08 AM	#31
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	IF THE PANABAS EVOLVED FROM A TOOL IT WOULD HAVE BEEN SOMETHING USED LIKE AN AXE TO CUT HARD WOOD , BAMBOO OR RATTAN AS IT WOULD HAVE BEEN TOO LARGE AND HEAVY TO CUT LIKE A SICKLE. AS TO ITS PRESENCE IN PICTURES OF HIGH RANKING DATU'S I SUSPECT THE DATU HAD ALL THE MEN PRESENT NECESSARY TO HOLD COURT AT ALL SUCH FUNCTIONS. WHEN A DATU HELD COURT IT WAS OFTEN TO DETERMINE GUILT OR INNOCENCE IN SOME SERIOUS MATTER SO EXECUTION WAS ALWAYS POSSIBLE, SO A EXECUTIONER WAS PROBABLY ALWAYS PRESENT. THERE WERE NO LEGNTHLY SERIES OF APPEALS AND A SENTENCE OF DEATH WAS OFTEN CARRIED OUT IMEDIATELY. THE PANABAS WOULD HAVE BEEN A SYMBOL OF ATHORITY AND A TOOL OF EXECUTION. MOSTLY CONJECTURE HERE BUT IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO SEE A LIST OF THE PEOPLE AND THEIR FUNCTIONS IN A DATU'S COURT. I NOTICE A OBJECT TO THE RIGHT IN THE GROUP PICTURE THAT HAS A SMALL HANDLE AND IS CLOTH COVERED WHAT IS IT? SOME VERY NICE PANABAS , I AM JEALOUS Last edited by VANDOO; 29th March 2005 at 03:35 PM.

30th March 2005, 12:21 AM	#42
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,203	Guys: The picture of the assembled Moro dignitaries is dominated by the two Americans in white and I am really surprised that an immigrant to the U.S. is the one to point out that the rotund gentleman in the center of the picture is William Howard Taft, then Governor of the Philippines and later President of the United States. Taft had left the Philippines by 1904, and from 1904-1908 he was supervising the construction of the Panama Canal. The other distinguished gentleman in white is Major General Leonard Wood, Governor of Moro Province and later Army Chief of Staff under President Taft. Wood was only in the Philippines briefly, serving as Governor of Moro Province from 1903-1906, during which time he commanded U.S. troops in putting down a Moro rebellion in 1904. I believe the photograph dates from 1903-1904, when both Taft and Wood were in the Philippines. Because the Moro in this picture are carrying weapons in close proximity to the distinguished U.S. administrators, it was probably taken before the Moro uprising that was put down by Wood. So I would guess the picture dates from 1903. Very interesting picture. Ian. In the time I was posting my message, Federico beat me to the ID of Taft. Last edited by Ian; 30th March 2005 at 01:16 AM.

29th March 2005, 04:31 AM	#32
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	i believe it's an umbrella...

29th March 2005, 07:53 PM	#37
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	MOST OF THE PEOPLE IN THE PICTURE SEEM TO BE WATCHING SOMETHING, PERHAPS ENTERTAINMENT, PUNISHMENT, PRESENTATIONS? (NO COULDN'T BE PRESENTATIONS AS NO ONE IS SLEEPING ) THE GUY TO THE LEFT SEEMS TO BE THE ONLY ONE TO SHOW HE FINDS THE WHOLE THING AMUSING. I FIND PHILLIPHINO AND MORO PEOPLE HAVE A GOOD SENSE OF HUMOR ALTHOUGH IT IS NOT OFTEN SHOWN AT OFFICIAL OR SERIOUS BUSINESS. A UMBRELLA HAD CROSSED MY MIND BUT I WAS THINKING STRANGE HILT RATHER THAN ORNATE UMBERLLA TIP, ROYAL UMBRELLAS ARE COMMON IN S.E. ASIA SO THAT IS MOST LIKELY.

29th March 2005, 11:17 PM	#38
Spunjer Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Witness Protection Program Posts: 1,730	fred, the dam* picture is now my wallpaper, how can i miss? LOL

29th March 2005, 11:32 PM	#39
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	that picture may simply be the results of the phenomena that happens in the Philippines, whenever a camera is raised, there will always be at least 20 people posing.

29th March 2005, 11:37 PM	#40
Bill Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Chicago area Posts: 327	boxing exhibition?

29th March 2005, 11:56 PM	#41
Federico Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA Posts: 312	Ughh...I have a caption for the pic somewhere, but I cant remember what book its in. But essentially Governor Taft is visiting Datu Uto (while Datu Uto retained the title of Datu rather than claim the title of Sultan for political reasons, in the last half of the 19th century he was by right and power pretty much Sultan of Buayan), and for some reason I want to say they are watching a bull-fight, but I cant remember. If Mabagani sees this thread I am sure he will remember the caption. Anyways, this is very early on into America's colonization of PI, as Datu Uto dies shortly after from a tropical disease (I believe it may have been from a cholera epidemic or was it Malaria I have his bio buried under a pile of other books, but am too lazy right now to dig). Oh well... Spunjer for all our joking, why do I have the feeling the guy on the left could probably kick all our A$$es without breaking a sweat. Anyways, just dont focus too much on him, remember the pretty weaponry as well

30th March 2005, 01:19 AM	#43
Conogre Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Clearwater, Florida Posts: 371	BUT he's too young to possibly know that he was later President Taft (maybe anyways). An immigrant, by the way,Ian, is THE logical person to be aware of such fantastic information/trivia as many to most Americans have little interest in our own history. Perhaps because there is so little of it? grin Mike