Heavy Nubian / Nigerian Short sword...age? comments?

katana · 10th November 2006, 10:31 PM

Sword finally arrived today, very heavy and solid......no way a tourist piece...blade is still quite sharp ...even though heavily rusted.....and has a nice 'ring' to it when struck. Gave the blade a careful 'scrape' and wire 'wooled' it ...some areas of deep pitting . Also has fine, diagonal lines which are slightly wavy. I thought at first that it could be a re-worked large file or rasp. But several things don't add up....the blade is a flattened diamond shape (in cross section) and there is evidence of 'forging' marks'. A re-worked 'file' blade often has the 'criss cross' surface noticeable on the thicker portions of the blade ....where it tapers to the 'edge' these tend to disappear either because they are ground/filed down (thus thinning the blade towards the edge) or, as it is forged the 'file teeth' are beaten into the 'file's core'. These 'wavy, diagonal lines traverse from one edge to the other

The hilt is very heavy, when handling the sword I noticed that by grasping the hilt near the top (leaves about 4cms of pommel protruding) gives the swinging action more power.....with the added advantage that the pommel could be used to strike an opponent in 'close quarter' combat.

Will post pics later.....I think I will need natural light to show up the detail.

Also, I re-posted some pics from this post that Ian (thanks)refered to
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=stars
There are many similarities to the hilt...

katana · 11th November 2006, 08:03 PM

Hi Gentlemen.....a few photos....any ideas or comments gratefully received...especially to the diagonal, slightly wavy lines

katana · 11th November 2006, 09:35 PM

It would help if I uploaded them.......

Tim Simmons · 11th November 2006, 09:49 PM

This is completely new to me. It certainly looks like it was made to do some harm. I do not think it has been forged from an old file, being there are no squashed scale like marks only the heavy use of a file.

katana · 12th November 2006, 11:33 AM

Hi Tim,
the blade 'rings' when tapped...suggesting good tempered steel. As mentioned before, the blade is quite sharp...even though there is no evidence of any re-sharpening. The rust I removed from the blade was very dark in colour, almost black, and was not 'loose'....hence the 'scraping'. It suggests reasonable age....early 20c...as a conservative estimate, but that is only my opinion. The blade seems very well made.....perhaps not locally made but, an adapted European blade

The hilt and overall finish is very good. It is a shame that there is no scabbard....assuming that it had one originally. If it did, It must have been weighted at the bottom to counteract the weight of the hilt....who knows??
There was another similarly constructed hilted short sword sold on eBay recently...the blade was almost square (in cross section)....a stabbing weapon. The seller stated that it had come from Benin (Yoruba tribe). Picture below.. I have been offered a similar sword (from another source), the hilt is cast bronze with a zooamorphic design with the same 'dirk' like blade.
Has anyone seen examples like this??

10th November 2006, 10:31 PM	#1
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Sword finally arrived today, very heavy and solid......no way a tourist piece...blade is still quite sharp ...even though heavily rusted.....and has a nice 'ring' to it when struck. Gave the blade a careful 'scrape' and wire 'wooled' it ...some areas of deep pitting . Also has fine, diagonal lines which are slightly wavy. I thought at first that it could be a re-worked large file or rasp. But several things don't add up....the blade is a flattened diamond shape (in cross section) and there is evidence of 'forging' marks'. A re-worked 'file' blade often has the 'criss cross' surface noticeable on the thicker portions of the blade ....where it tapers to the 'edge' these tend to disappear either because they are ground/filed down (thus thinning the blade towards the edge) or, as it is forged the 'file teeth' are beaten into the 'file's core'. These 'wavy, diagonal lines traverse from one edge to the other The hilt is very heavy, when handling the sword I noticed that by grasping the hilt near the top (leaves about 4cms of pommel protruding) gives the swinging action more power.....with the added advantage that the pommel could be used to strike an opponent in 'close quarter' combat. Will post pics later.....I think I will need natural light to show up the detail. Also, I re-posted some pics from this post that Ian (thanks)refered to http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=stars There are many similarities to the hilt... Attached Images

11th November 2006, 09:35 PM	#3
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	It would help if I uploaded them....... Attached Images

12th November 2006, 11:33 AM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Hi Tim, the blade 'rings' when tapped...suggesting good tempered steel. As mentioned before, the blade is quite sharp...even though there is no evidence of any re-sharpening. The rust I removed from the blade was very dark in colour, almost black, and was not 'loose'....hence the 'scraping'. It suggests reasonable age....early 20c...as a conservative estimate, but that is only my opinion. The blade seems very well made.....perhaps not locally made but, an adapted European blade The hilt and overall finish is very good. It is a shame that there is no scabbard....assuming that it had one originally. If it did, It must have been weighted at the bottom to counteract the weight of the hilt....who knows?? There was another similarly constructed hilted short sword sold on eBay recently...the blade was almost square (in cross section)....a stabbing weapon. The seller stated that it had come from Benin (Yoruba tribe). Picture below.. I have been offered a similar sword (from another source), the hilt is cast bronze with a zooamorphic design with the same 'dirk' like blade. Has anyone seen examples like this?? Attached Images

11th November 2006, 08:03 PM	#2
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Hi Gentlemen.....a few photos....any ideas or comments gratefully received...especially to the diagonal, slightly wavy lines

11th November 2006, 09:49 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,755	This is completely new to me. It certainly looks like it was made to do some harm. I do not think it has been forged from an old file, being there are no squashed scale like marks only the heavy use of a file.