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#1 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Sweden
Posts: 181
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I need to re-attach a silver crossguard on a shamshir. I have decided that i want to solder it to the grip straps. I have seen it done that way on other similar swords. Fell free to speak up if you think that there is a better way.
A professional golsmith that I talked to said, no problem he can do that. But, he also asked how much heat the horn can handle, since the solder will reach 800 degree celsius. I have no idea, anyone that knows or can point me to a source that has that information? Also, im like 90%, sure its rhino horn, but could you look at the pictures and confirm? Many thanks for your time. Last edited by Drabant1701; 29th December 2018 at 03:14 PM. |
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#2 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Germany
Posts: 195
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Was not soldered to the cross guard with any original
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#3 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 5,503
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Rhino horn is a lump of congealed hair. Doubt it will not be damaged.
Why wouldn't you try https://www.walmart.com/ip/6X-DEVCON...5-ML/111524404 or something from the family, such as https://www.walmart.com/ip/10240-Pla...vcon/700864821 It is used in metal industry, holds like nothing else. |
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#4 |
Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 456
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You will ruin that horn if a jeweler puts heat to it
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#5 |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Sweden
Posts: 181
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Thanks for your replies! Thats why I ask first
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#6 |
Member
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Buraimi Oman, on the border with the UAE
Posts: 4,408
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The steel stuff will be safer... Heat will melt it like butter... It is Rhino
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#7 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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You can NEVER silver solder onto horn or any organic matter. Even soft solder is too hot (and is much lower in temperature).
No offense, but your jeweler friend is nuts! (I too make jewelry and so lots of silver soldering). |
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#8 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 5,503
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Jose,
Aren’t you too harsh on the jeweler? He said he could solder it, but wanted to know first whether horn will survive it. IMHO, he was perfect. |
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#9 |
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 232
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OK. The hilt is rhino. Heat will not MELT it, just BURN IT. I have broken bits and pieces of rhino horn from messed up Ethiopian swords, so I decided to try. If you try to burn one of your own fingernail (after you clip it.....) you will get the same result. It chars more than burns. You can scrape off the charred surface and re-polish it. This is not what one wants to do to a good piece of rhino horn. A good epoxy will do a better job. By the way, there are epoxies designed for jewellery making. Cheers, Ron
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#10 | |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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I do apologize if I came across caustic. |
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#11 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: What is still UK
Posts: 5,780
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You could do it using a puk welding machine.. I have one ideal for this type of job. It is welding through 10x optics with a needle electrode. Expensive kit and a steep learning curve. An even better way is laser welding but I do not have a laser welding unit and your job might not fit in the laser unit. I live in the UK. I would find a jeweller or silversmith in your area that is using a puk welding unit near you should be straight forward. I better pic would help.
https://www.bettsmetalsales.com/jewe...uk-welding/puk |
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#12 | |
Member
Join Date: Apr 2015
Location: Sweden
Posts: 181
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I will have to have a good think about this one. That plastic steel is a good option to, but I liked the idea of soldering since it can be un-done, as you all know epoxys are not easy to remove once hardened. |
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#13 |
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Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Sweden
Posts: 688
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Ideally I guess you would want to restore the item using historically correct methods if possible? I think I have read posts here about using traditional resins to re-attach grips etc.
You may want to check out Paraloid B-72 (http://www.conservation-resources.co...roducts_id=600) which is supposedly used by professionals at museums to restore antiques. It’s favoured as it’s less visible, degrades less, and is supposedly reversible. I have found it more difficult than expected to work with myself. I would try buying the glue tube version rather than the pellets. |
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#14 |
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Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: What is still UK
Posts: 5,780
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Yes worth doing properly. Done well would not look any different to. silver soldering. Someone in Stockholm will have either a PUK weld or Laser unit. They will probably want a low 3 figure sum for this rather precious job.
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#15 |
EAAF Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 7,200
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This would definitely be a better option.
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#16 |
Vikingsword Staff
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: The Aussie Bush
Posts: 4,167
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Guys:
Just a reminder. If you are conducting transactions please do so offline using PM or email. We try to keep this forum free of commerce. Ian. |
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#17 |
Member
Join Date: May 2014
Location: Ireland
Posts: 539
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Hi
I know nothing about laser welding having never looked at it before this morning when I watched a you tube video or two Will it not leave a bead of weld at the join of the 2 metals which will look wrong And from my experience your eye will be drawn to the repair every time you pick up the item The proper way would be to remove the handles and solder on the inside as it was originally made as far as I know but I might be incorrect on the manafacturing process , would this be possible It looks to be a lovely sword and you are a brave man to do working on it Can the cross guard be wedged in place with spacers of balsa, this will be totally reversible and as the sword is now a decorative item the repair will not detract With this welding job you have one go at it and the people doing the job are not expert at the repair job, quiet a scary situation Regards Ken |
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#18 |
Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: What is still UK
Posts: 5,780
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Ken, this would only be done by experienced crafts people. This job would be on the micro scale even if you had to feed in silver wire to fill large gaps it would not look like the weld on an international oil fed pipe.
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