just bought this...

[chevalier]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=170234564349


not sure if youd call that a "gurade" or not. its ethiopian from 1890 or thereabouts. but constructed in the 1796 LCS style. im assuming the blade is solingen.....

[Lew]

Very nice . Not exactly a gurade but pretty close.

Congrats

Lew

[chevalier]

yea, im still not sure if its solingen or not

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by chevalier

yea, im still not sure if its solingen or not

Actually its Finnish

Why would you think its not from Solingen?

Playing the name game with describing swords can be frustrating, but from my understanding is on Ethiopian swords, the straight blade swords are typically sa'if; the deeply parabolic sickle like swords are shotel, and curved sabres are GURADE/GORADE.
Whether technically correct or not, the widely accepted term for these European style sabres is GURADE (the horn grip swords with the same hilt as shotel and mounted with military style trade blades are techically considered gurade, though often mistermed shotel because of the hilt form).

This one is very nice, and it is amazing to see such straightforward description in this medium, the period and identification patently correct.

The G.G. marking is distinctly German and essentially a mark of guarantee, GESETZLICH GESCHUETZT, often appeared on forte of German blades, usually of course from Solingen. The blade etching seen on various German makers as well as on the English exports as Ethiopia (then Abyssinia) received weapons from both.

[chevalier]

i knew passau produced alot of blades too but then this one dident have the wolf mark on it like most passau blades did.


i understand wilkinson also made alot of blades for ethiopia as well.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by chevalier

i knew passau produced alot of blades too but then this one dident have the wolf mark on it like most passau blades did.


i understand wilkinson also made alot of blades for ethiopia as well.

I meant to quote, but inadvertantly edited your post with my response, so I will rewrite here.

Passau was a prominent arms and armour center in early times, and the running wolf has long been considered to have been a marking associated with that center. In later years, with the advent of Solingen, that center declined markedly with smiths in Solingen often using the marking in varying interpretations. Though the Passau origin for the running wolf mark is seemingly well established it is often discussed and debates over speculation continue. It was apparantly known in Spain, as noted adopted by smiths in Solingen, and later used defiantly by German makers in England in 17th century Hounslow and Shotley Bridge. The latest use for the running wolf I am aware of would be the 18th century swords by S. Harvey in England.

In the period of this gurade, late 19th century to early 20th, Germany was a key exporter of swords and blades to Abyssinia in addition of course to many other countries. The swords were often routed through export intermediaries naturally, and products from both Germany and England were sent to Abyssinia in varying degree and situations.
The Wilkinson contracts of substance were in agreements with Emperor Haile Selassie in the 1930's.

Wilkinson swords always were marked and were both of sabre (gurade) type and the deeply curved sickle form of the traditional shotel. The German blades, as noted, were Solingen products (not Passau and no wolf markings are known beyond 18th century England).

There seems to be wide range in your interests. Your interest in Finnish swords seems to have given way to Ethiopian. What are your actual specific interests and field of collecting?

[ward]

Saif is the arabic word for sword. So it is pretty vauge

[Jim McDougall]

You got it Ward! Most of these terms, often adopted by collectors to describe swords by typology are general terms used in varying cultural spheres for that weapon in general. The term shotel, as noted, means big knife, Gurade is said to mean curved sword, and as always, sa'if means in Arabic...sword.
We have discussed these terms and tried to establish consistancies futally for years.

Now, the big question is.....will Chevalier respond to this one!!!

[chevalier]

im actually interested in a wide range of antique bladed weaponry, mainly islamic/indo-persian/southeast asian/finnish/east european in nature.


im an ameteur collector who pretty much works on a budget when it comes to blades.


i am most interested in indian swords (tulwars/tegha/sosun patta/khanda/firangi) followed by various islamic swords and finnish/nordic knives/swords.

i am also rapidly becoming enamored with solingen/wilkinson/ect trade blades


my name is john and im from kalamazoo michigan. just to give everyone some personal info

[ward]

chevalier If I may suggest read as much as possible on the subject and buy the best pieces in your budget as possible. It is better to have 1 excellent example then 10 poor or 5 mediocre examples. This forum has a mix of people of different interest and different income and collecting levels. I personally would be be more interested in a early example of the type of sword you had posted. When you get into manufactured blades in comparison to hand made blades you are getting into more industrial factory work instead of a particular artisans work. It is a matter of what you are interested in collecting and the reasons behind it

[Jim McDougall]

Hi Chevalier,
Thank you for responding, and for giving us some insight into your interests, which are admirably wide in scope. Ward's advice is extremely well stated, and most of us can attest to the importance of using caution in acquiring pieces, avoid allowing emotion to override good sense. As a well scarred, once passionate collector who has learned this well over many years, I gratefully have become able to recollect these as 'adventures' and accept them as 'tuition' .

Stay with us here and feel free to ask all you want....the guys here are incredibly knowledgable on all manner of weaponry, and if you use the search feature you can pretty much find answers in some degree on everything. Check the 'classic threads' and read the early makers trademarks and you will find lots of detail on the trade blades you note as having your attention.

My collecting days are over, but I very much love researching weapons, and always look forward to the examples everyone shares here. I think we all have pretty much dealt with limited budgets in collecting, so it is very important to 'fire for effect' and knowledge is your most essential ammunition.We're with ya! welcome to the forum John.

All the best,
Jim

[chevalier]

thanks very much everyone!

since i got my stimulus check ive been on kind of a tear looking for (and bidding on) weapons that catch my fancy, i lost out on two balkan daggers that i thought i had in the bag till someone slipped in at the last second and beat me to the punch:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=230264213939



and


http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=300234347749


i was really interested in the second one because it looks like some sort of makeshift kindjal.


anyways i hope to accquire one more good peice before i stop buying for a while (and start saving for the next potential peice! ) bills to pay and groceries to buy, hehe.

[chevalier]

actually my current weapon wishlist is as follows: (in no particular order)


yataghan

moro kris

tulwar

tegha

khyber knife/sword

piso podang

parang nabur


strangely enough, i have very little interest in japanese blades, everyone else i know who is into sword collecting loves them more than any other blade.