Brilliant Minds Neded: a Multi Barrel Illustration of 1511

[Matchlock]

A few more.

Looking at these woodcuts there is no doubt about the fact that all these authors and illustrators copied from each other and especially from earlier works!

Copyright had not been invented.

Michael

[fearn]

Hi Michael,

The ones you just showed look much more familiar. Now I know where the modern reconstructionists are using to make those trebuchets and siege equipment. They need to make one of those assault dragons, though.

As an aside, people are still reprinting Roman works with new pictures. As a child, I was given one that had some of Pliny's Naturalis historia (in latin) with fanciful pictures attached. They'd picked Pliny's more colorful mistakes to illustrate, of course. Even under modern law, the old texts are in the public domain, so someone could take Flavius Vegetius Renatus and illustrate it as they liked.

Project for someone here, perhaps, without herbal inspiration?

F

[fernando]

Originally Posted by fearn

... Project for someone here, perhaps, without herbal inspiration? ...

Not an exciting task, though.
Things would be much too dull .
This is what happens when they ran out of such resource ... even the overimaginative author of Vier Bücher der Rytterschafft; cannons do look ... like cannons .
Fernando

.

[Matchlock]

Hi, Fearn and Fernando,

I do like your ideas, pals!

BTW, the following are from: Anonymous: Ingenieurskunst- und Wunderbuch (Book of Engineering and Wonders), Weimar, Germany, 1522.

Meet well known earlier illustrative motifs, just slightly altered.

Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

Originally Posted by fernando

Yes, are there copies or reprints of this work acquirable, Michael ?
Suddenly you will be responsible for the da Vinci's family having to pay copyright fees to Flavius Vegetius Renatus's heirs .
Fernando

Oh, he was a veterinarian .

Hi Fernando,

Believe me, I have been searching for reprints ever since I got my hands on the first original book in the Munich State Library where these scans are taken from. I could not find any reprints.

Apart from that, Vegetius' texts have been reprinted throughout the 16th, 17th and 18th centuries in numerous variations, many of which do not contain any illustrations at all. I have found only one other copy printed in Paris in 1534 or 1536 which is profusely illustrated including early firearms.

Let's be patient though. The big libraries keep scanning more and more books from their hidden treasures and publishing them on the web. Within a few years our knowledge will have been immeasurably enriched!

Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

Originally Posted by Pukka Bundook

Hello Michael.

Brilliant minds needed,...and you include My name? This prooves I have you fooled!!

It is interesting this contrivance is viewed from above, or in other words, the only safe position anywhere close to it.
It could make a one-off land-mine so to speak, but is a bit complex for that!

To me, it appears to be the sort of thing a school-boy would doodle in the border of his excersise book, when his teacher was proving to be unusually boring..............I had many such fantastic devices in my books!...Stemming not from any brilliance of mind, but more from the mind being closed down, and the hand still 'running'!
That is about all I can say.

With very best wishes,

Richard.

Hello Richard,

Though mostly on your side with all your profound thoughts and notes, in this case (a school-boy doodling around in ... his exercise book) I feel that Emanuel's explanation is more intriguing: the outcome is just far too brilliant in its basic understanding of technical features as well as in the wide range of its devices to possibly stem from a doodling simple mind.

Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

Originally Posted by Manolo

Aha! Now we know where Salvador Dali got his inspiration from. He ripped off 16th century woodcuts

It does seem like all of these illustrations make some sort of commentary on the times. The jester with the pointed nose is a lier, has a sharp tongue and pointed/sharp wit. He is set up like a siege engine on wheels, so perhaps it refers to tactics of winning sieges through wit, lies, and good oratory skills.

The other siege engines look like experimentations with rams, lances, guns and maybe even a draw-bridge.

The tower and the metronome-like contraption seem to demonstrate some sort of awe or apprehension with machinery and mechanical contraptions. The tower with the connected wheels doesn't seem to do anything, unless it is a signal tower of sorts. The soldier pulling on the rope appears to have a meaningless job...perhaps a comentary on the obsolescence of human labour in the face of mechanization? By that time water and wind mills were already used to drive many industrial/craft processes - milling, blacksmithing, carpentry...

Further down there is a tower with three sets of wheels in a triangular arrangement, connected by gear to a wind turbine...wind-power locomotion anyone?

Just some thoughts...thanks Michael for posting these facinating illustrations.

Emanuel

Hi Emanuel,

In my eyes, your observations and conclusions are stunningly well on the topic. Your technical gift and discerning wit are a bit beyond my limited horizon, I have to admit!

Many thanks for those great comments on that indeed fascinating subject!

Best,
Michael

[fernando]

Originally Posted by fearn

...Just wish I knew what kind of text went with these pictures...

The first twenty and so pages are an introdutory text ... in german ... old german ... in a gothic font . Perhaps Michael has an idea of what it is about.

Originally Posted by Matchlock

...Believe me, I have been searching for reprints ever since i got my hands on the first original book in the Munich State Library where these scans are taken from. I could not find any reprints ...The big libraries keep scanning more and more books from their hidden treasures and publishing them on the web...

In the meantime we can do with a PDF version; it was possible to download it from the digital library link.
If anybody wants a copy and has dificulties downloading it, just tell; i will email one to him.
Fernando.

[Matchlock]

I can read the Gothic print type quite well but to me, as in many contemporary books, it seems a bit bewildering and does not give any clue to the illustrations. Also, the text states that the book is about knighthood and the virtues of noble personalities whereas the illustrations depict mercenaries at siege work and fantabulous devices of variuos kind. It is true that some of them wear parts of knightly armor but none is shown to wear a suit of armor. We know from many contemporary illustrative sources that that was the usual Landsknechts' mixed wear: parts of armor or a mail shirt combined with the "buntes Wams", the traditional colorful mercenaries' clothing and the feathered beret.

In the late Middle Ages, colorful clothing was a strict privilege of the nobility and the clergy, while brown and grey clothes were allocated to mercenaries and peasants. At the middle of the 15th century an interesting kind of cultural revolution was started, combined with a radically new aplomb of the mercenaries. They became aware of the fact that wars and land could only be won by their social group, the commons, and that the nobility were reliant on them.

That understanding led to a completely new self confidence of the mercenaries. As free lancers, they could choose for themelves what war lord to serve. Their weapons and clothes were their own property and the more skillful they were in the use of their weapons the higher was their pay. The war booty being part of their pay, many of them used parts of armor and better weapons to improve their own defense and increase their value when bargaining with another war lord for their next pay.

All in all, I do not think that an actual understanding of the text is necessary. In my opinion it is the close study of the illustrations that is most important.

Michael

[Matchlock]

Another variant of well known devices but some new additions as well.

Michael

[Matchlock]

More.

[fernando]

Great drawings, Michael .
Fertile imagination ... the main source for inventions of efective stuff.
I feel pity for the guys that had all the work to build that continuous movement apparatus for the flooding of the castle (tower); the smart Knight will easily get away by using such a brilliant a inflatable vest .
Fernando

BTW, multi barrel devices are always contemplated .

[Matchlock]

Very well put, Fernando,

Thank you so much,
Michael

[cornelistromp]

HI Michael,

yes, this multi barrel Illustration can be fired, all the barrels with the ignition
of one barrel.(your first picture)
I have a publication of a 12 barrel gun out of the Visser collection with this same principle. Iam in the Monaco at the moment but will place the publication in this thread coming weekend.

Best regards

[Matchlock]

Hi Cornelis,

I am looking forward to seeing your post! Return quickly!

Best,
Michael

[cornelistromp]

Hi Michael,

I think the multi barrel Illustration can be fired, there are 2 different possibilities.

1.Model with separate external vents.
After 3 barrels have been fired, you turn the raster 45 grad and shoot the next 3 cannonballs at the target turn the raster again 45 grad and so on.
same principle as the visser cannon auction at Bonham's Nov 2007.
2.Model where the barrels have internal vents.
All the barrels are fired by a single ignition at the central knot where all the barrels come together. Principle as five barreled flintlock pistol
in the Visser collection. However must say that I don't know where the gunman has to stand without being shot by himself when firing the raster.

best regards

[Matchlock]

Hi Cornelis,

Thank you so much for this contribution.

The ingnition system based on the internal vents/touchholes reminds me instantly of the superimposed load principle dealt with at large by Colonel D.R. Baxter: Superimposed Load Firearms 1360-1860, Hong Kong, 1966, which has doubtlessly remained the final word on the subject.

Best,
Michael

[Matchlock]

A 'high tech' adjustable bronze cannon carriage from an early 16th century manuscript.

Michael