Damascus steel - Age guarantees Quality?

[FenrisWolf]

Lately I've been noticing a significant increase in the number of Damascus steel swords and daggers surfacing on ebay with extremely bold patterns, escpecially Indian weapons. Now the majority of these are new blades, often with fancy metalwork and koftgari inlay, but occasionally one show up advertised as as antique that is just too good to be true, bold Damascus pattern steel with crisp, unworn koftgari on every avaialble surface.

My question is, does anyone know anything about all this 'new' Damascus steel; is it being made in the same manner as the original wootz blades, or is it a shabby copy? I haven't been burned yet, but I've been eying a few of them. It wouldn't hurt to have an idea beforehand what one of the 'new' damacus blades is like, quality-wise.

Fenris

[Andrew]

Some extremely fine wootz and pattern-welded steel is being produced today, Fenris.

I'm familiar with the weapons I think you're referring to, however. The examples I handled had rebated edges. I didn't have the opportunity to test them, but I suspect they were not heat-treated very well (if at all). In my opinion, decorative things.

Each weapon is different, and your results may vary.

[Rich]

I would speculate that these are not Wootz, but a mechanical damascus
likely made by India Steelcrafts or even made in China (they are
copying all sorts of "ethnic" swords/knives).
Haven't handled or seen one except in
catalogs. Mainly pretty wall hangers. Age is definitely NOT a determination
of quality. Junk has been made in all times and all places.

Rich

[RhysMichael]

Originally Posted by Rich

I would speculate that these are not Wootz, but a mechanical damascus
likely made by India Steelcrafts or even made in China (they are
copying all sorts of "ethnic" swords/knives).
Haven't handled or seen one except in
catalogs. Mainly pretty wall hangers. Age is definitely NOT a determination
of quality. Junk has been made in all times and all places.

Rich

While most of what you see is pattern welded, There are a few people making crucible steel today. There was a lecture on it and examples of it in Timonium last year. But I must completed agree that junk has been made in all ages.

[FenrisWolf]

Originally Posted by RhysMichael

While most of what you see is pattern welded, There are a few people making crucible steel today. There was a lecture on it and examples of it in Timonium last year. But I must completed agree that junk has been made in all ages.

It's interesting, until this comment I'd actually forgotten that there is a difference between wootz Damascus steel and pattern-welded Damascus steel. Part of that is due to the way I was introduced to the subject.

My earliest interest in period weaponry was in the blades carried by the Vikings, who were carrying pattern-welded swords as early as 900 AD. They had no reliable source for high carbon steel, so what they did have they stretched by combining it with mild steel and even iron, twisting rods of each into a spiral beofr forging them together. There are also historical records from the time that indicate how highly prized true 'Damascus' swords were by the Viking traders who obtained them in the middle east (and if you don't think they were running around there, ask the caretakers of the Hagia Sofia in Istanbul about the Viking Runes some graffiti artist scratched into one of the balustrades there!) The references I read at the time referred to the Vikings' efforts as 'Damascus' steel as well, and I honestly can't remember a single text that made a point of separating the two types. Time to refresh my memory I guess...

Fenris

[Andrew]

It's a very common point of confusion, Fenris. "Damascus" is often used generically to refer to crucible steel (i.e. wootz, bulat), pattern-welded steel and folded steel.