Strange Shield for Discussion

A.alnakkas · 6th February 2024, 03:47 PM

apologies for the late reply.

The shield diameter is 47 cm or 18.5 inches. The shield will be shipped to me later on and I can do more measurements, its currently in the care of my friend in the US, Nate Hope.

Here are some thoughts, I believe its a shield and it being a hat (or a helm) is farfetched. I think so because the handles are too close to each other and too far up, along with the cushion which appears if its for a head, it wont do much cushioning. Unless its specifically was made for a person with an extremely long forehead and ears up high in their head.

A feature I noticed is that the two straps are consistently made of different material and different fitting method in my shield and others shared by Gavin. It appears that one strap is made of leather and the other is made of wood fitted with two thin leather straps. The fact that its on the 3 items available for us to examine shows purposefulness and an odd option to do for a hat.

RobT · 7th February 2024, 01:54 AM

A Alnakkus,

Thanks for the diameter. Armed with that information, I did a google search to see what the typical jingasa diameter was. I only looked at jingasa shaped like your item and the items in the other two threads. I did find one jingasa with an 18.5 inch diameter and three with 17 to 17.5 inch diameters but the bulk of the examples were about 16 to 16.5 inches. The next most common diameter was 14 to 14.5 inches.

I don’t believe the reasons you cite to discount my theory are valid because, if the item started out as a jingasa, the current close together handles and scanty padding would not have been original to the piece but only would have been added when the item was repurposed from a hat to a shield.

Perhaps with your permission (and subject to the moderator’s approval), a request could be placed on the Nihonto Message Board asking them to have a look at this thread (and the other two). If any folks could give us a yea or nay on the jingasa theory it would be them.

Sincerely,
RobT

A.alnakkas · 7th February 2024, 02:40 AM

Thanks Rob, I am quite interested in their information so please do!

Ian · 8th February 2024, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RobT

A Alnakkus, ...

Perhaps with your permission (and subject to the moderator’s approval), a request could be placed on the Nihonto Message Board asking them to have a look at this thread (and the other two). If any folks could give us a yea or nay on the jingasa theory it would be them.

Sincerely,
RobT

Rob, I don't see any problem with contacting the Nihonto Message Board and requesting an opinion on this item, provided A A is okay with that. Ian

A.alnakkas · 8th February 2024, 11:38 AM

The construction of the grips and material used gives some info on how its used? all the available examples for us to examine have the same construction with one strap made of leather and the other made of wood.

RobT · 9th February 2024, 12:00 AM

Hi All,

I posted an ID request in the katchu section of the Nihonto Message Board. Hopefully, we will either get a positive ID or be able to rule out the Japanese jingasa theory.

Sincerely,
RobT

Lee · 9th February 2024, 02:43 AM

Here is a link to the NMB thread:
https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topi...sible-jingasa/

A jingasa was certainly my own first thought when this item was posted.

Gavin Nugent · 9th February 2024, 04:53 AM

I ran a broad image search over "Inside a jingasa".

It seems all I found has mounting points for the chin straps and head pads that all look much further spaced than this hand grip, yet none of these shields show any indication of having such broader mounting points originally?

7th February 2024, 01:54 AM	#2
RobT Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 533	A Proposal A Alnakkus, Thanks for the diameter. Armed with that information, I did a google search to see what the typical jingasa diameter was. I only looked at jingasa shaped like your item and the items in the other two threads. I did find one jingasa with an 18.5 inch diameter and three with 17 to 17.5 inch diameters but the bulk of the examples were about 16 to 16.5 inches. The next most common diameter was 14 to 14.5 inches. I don’t believe the reasons you cite to discount my theory are valid because, if the item started out as a jingasa, the current close together handles and scanty padding would not have been original to the piece but only would have been added when the item was repurposed from a hat to a shield. Perhaps with your permission (and subject to the moderator’s approval), a request could be placed on the Nihonto Message Board asking them to have a look at this thread (and the other two). If any folks could give us a yea or nay on the jingasa theory it would be them. Sincerely, RobT

8th February 2024, 11:38 AM	#5
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	The construction of the grips and material used gives some info on how its used? all the available examples for us to examine have the same construction with one strap made of leather and the other made of wood. Attached Images

9th February 2024, 12:00 AM	#6
RobT Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 533	Info Request Sent Hi All, I posted an ID request in the katchu section of the Nihonto Message Board. Hopefully, we will either get a positive ID or be able to rule out the Japanese jingasa theory. Sincerely, RobT

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6th February 2024, 03:47 PM	#1
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	apologies for the late reply. The shield diameter is 47 cm or 18.5 inches. The shield will be shipped to me later on and I can do more measurements, its currently in the care of my friend in the US, Nate Hope. Here are some thoughts, I believe its a shield and it being a hat (or a helm) is farfetched. I think so because the handles are too close to each other and too far up, along with the cushion which appears if its for a head, it wont do much cushioning. Unless its specifically was made for a person with an extremely long forehead and ears up high in their head. A feature I noticed is that the two straps are consistently made of different material and different fitting method in my shield and others shared by Gavin. It appears that one strap is made of leather and the other is made of wood fitted with two thin leather straps. The fact that its on the 3 items available for us to examine shows purposefulness and an odd option to do for a hat.

7th February 2024, 02:40 AM	#3
A.alnakkas Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Kuwait Posts: 1,340	Thanks Rob, I am quite interested in their information so please do!

9th February 2024, 02:43 AM	#7
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 932	Here is a link to the NMB thread: https://www.militaria.co.za/nmb/topi...sible-jingasa/ A jingasa was certainly my own first thought when this item was posted.

9th February 2024, 04:53 AM	#8
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	I ran a broad image search over "Inside a jingasa". It seems all I found has mounting points for the chin straps and head pads that all look much further spaced than this hand grip, yet none of these shields show any indication of having such broader mounting points originally?