Keris with nice Naga Kinatah blade for comments

kai · 7th July 2019, 09:14 PM

Hello Séverin,

Congrats, another excellent acquisition!

IMVHO this blade is considerably older than the 19th c.; very good quality forging as well as sculpturing/kinatah, too.

The hilt exhibits really good workmanship. Not one of the very early hilts but a really good example with interesting details. Could you post larger pics of all sides (and the top), please?

The blade, selut, and hilt are a really fitting ensemble and may well be original.

The top/crosspiece of the scabbard seems to be intact; the stem is often crudely shaped when a pendok is covering it originally. Only close inspection may allow to verify whether the stem and/or the pendok got added later.

Regards,
Kai

kai · 7th July 2019, 09:24 PM

P.S.: Many collectors catalog their pieces and also mark them; thus, a number does not automatically suggest a former museum collection.

Marcokeris · 7th July 2019, 09:44 PM

Beautiful, very beautiful keris @@

David · 8th July 2019, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kai

IMVHO this blade is considerably older than the 19th c.; very good quality forging as well as sculpturing/kinatah, too.

The blade, selut, and hilt are a really fitting ensemble and may well be original.

Kai, i agree with most of your assessment, but i am curious what leads you to believe that this blade is "considerably" older than 19th century and also what you mean when you say "considerably".
Also, i see a mendak here, albeit an unusual one, not a selut.

A. G. Maisey · 8th July 2019, 06:20 AM

I think I can see a nice older keris with a very nice hilt, but for a keris that presents as this one does I am not able to give any further opinion on the blade without holding it in my hand and subjecting to microscopic examination.

The hilt is very nice indeed.

Jean · 8th July 2019, 10:01 AM

Well, everybody agrees that this a very nice and rare old kris!

The blade was over-cleaned (mechanically?, some rust spots are still visible) but not etched recently I think. Regarding its age, 19th century starts on year 1800 so I doubt that it is "considerably" older.
I would have hoped that Alan could say a little more about this piece even if it is difficult from the pictures.
Regards

Sajen · 8th July 2019, 10:15 AM

Hello Séverin,

Beautiful keris! I am a little bit jealous.

I think that the sarung fit the blade well enough. Regarding the age, certainly 19th century but could be older, who knows.

Please turn the hilt a little bit more to the left.

Regards,
Detlef

A. G. Maisey · 8th July 2019, 10:31 AM

Jean, I avoided the use of the word "old", I used "older" instead.

Frankly I'm troubled by two things, the pamor and the type of applied gold.

It is absolutely impossible for me to form an opinion on this keris from a photograph.

Jean · 8th July 2019, 10:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Frankly I'm troubled by two things, the pamor and the type of applied gold.

Thank you Alan. As a French I am not famliliar with the term "older" as we only know it as "older than" (Harrap's dictionary).
Could you please elaborate a bit (in broad terms) about what troubles you with the pamor and applied gold, and does it affect your age estimate or anything else about this piece?
Regards

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7th July 2019, 09:14 PM	#1
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Hello Séverin, Congrats, another excellent acquisition! IMVHO this blade is considerably older than the 19th c.; very good quality forging as well as sculpturing/kinatah, too. The hilt exhibits really good workmanship. Not one of the very early hilts but a really good example with interesting details. Could you post larger pics of all sides (and the top), please? The blade, selut, and hilt are a really fitting ensemble and may well be original. The top/crosspiece of the scabbard seems to be intact; the stem is often crudely shaped when a pendok is covering it originally. Only close inspection may allow to verify whether the stem and/or the pendok got added later. Regards, Kai

7th July 2019, 09:24 PM	#2
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	P.S.: Many collectors catalog their pieces and also mark them; thus, a number does not automatically suggest a former museum collection.

7th July 2019, 09:44 PM	#3
Marcokeris Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Italy Posts: 928	Beautiful, very beautiful keris @@

8th July 2019, 06:20 AM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,135	I think I can see a nice older keris with a very nice hilt, but for a keris that presents as this one does I am not able to give any further opinion on the blade without holding it in my hand and subjecting to microscopic examination. The hilt is very nice indeed.

8th July 2019, 10:01 AM	#6
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Well, everybody agrees that this a very nice and rare old kris! The blade was over-cleaned (mechanically?, some rust spots are still visible) but not etched recently I think. Regarding its age, 19th century starts on year 1800 so I doubt that it is "considerably" older. I would have hoped that Alan could say a little more about this piece even if it is difficult from the pictures. Regards

8th July 2019, 10:15 AM	#7
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,529	Hello Séverin, Beautiful keris! I am a little bit jealous. I think that the sarung fit the blade well enough. Regarding the age, certainly 19th century but could be older, who knows. Please turn the hilt a little bit more to the left. Regards, Detlef

8th July 2019, 10:31 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,135	Jean, I avoided the use of the word "old", I used "older" instead. Frankly I'm troubled by two things, the pamor and the type of applied gold. It is absolutely impossible for me to form an opinion on this keris from a photograph.