Help with possible origin

Alan62 · 1st April 2006, 05:42 AM

I ran across this today and I can't seem to figure out what it is exactly or where is comes from.I know it's not a sword but you folks always seem to have answers on very difficult questions.
The first thing that came to my mind was a Kubuki's drum or Tom Tom of some kind or perhaps some kind of religious drum.It appears to be oreintal.
It is 4 inches thick and 10 inches across with paintings on both sides on what appears to be stretch skin of some kind.I will attach better pics when my camera is finished charging.
Any ideas or oppinions welcomed and appreciated
Thanks

Alan62 · 1st April 2006, 06:04 AM

The one side has a small hole

But it is still a pretty cool piece

PUFF · 1st April 2006, 06:47 AM

The black rectangle in the last pic might help. Worth to take a close-up pic of the thing.

Alan62 · 1st April 2006, 07:00 AM

Thanks Puff ,Good thinking

yuanzhumin · 1st April 2006, 09:03 AM

Hello
Living in a country of chinese culture, it is easy for me to recognize the chinese style and influence in this drum. Everything is chinese in the shape, the colors (red) and the traditional motives (dragon and phoenix, symbol for the emperor and the empress). But the way the drawing is made is different, something confirmed by the fact that the caracters drawn on it are not chinese, nor corean or japanese. So I guessed it was from a country very much influenced by China or even a minority inside China. The most obvious choice is Mongolia or the chinese region of Inner Mongolia.
I checked the few caracters diplayed on the drums and they are definitly from the old mongolian writing. You can check by yourself through the following link:
http://www.omniglot.com/writing/mongolian.htm
One more thing, this traditional alphabet is not used anymore. It has been replaced in the 30's by latin and cyrillic alphabet. So I guess this drum has been made before the 30's.
Hope this will help.
Yuanzhumin

ariel · 1st April 2006, 10:16 AM

I remember seeing Tibetan praying wheels and armoires with similar designs and colors.

Alan62 · 1st April 2006, 01:52 PM

Thank You Yuanzhumin and Ariel,
I do feel it is from before the 30s for sure as it shows definate signs of age.
There is an oval with some letters, I think, on the other side but it is so faint that I cannot make it out. I have highlighted the oval with green dots and I think I see "RUSIN" if you look closely at the bottom of the oval.Maybe it is some kind of import mark or something

yuanzhumin · 1st April 2006, 03:21 PM

I also thought of Tibet and even Mandchuria, whose writing is very similar for the neophyte like me. But after careful thinking, I abandonned the tibetan option. It's very subjective, I have to say. May be I'm completely wrong.

But the fact that there is latin or even cyrillic letters on the other side of the drum could corroborate the mongolian option, in the 20's/30's.

Alan62 · 1st April 2006, 03:59 PM

Thank You Again Yuanzhumin

1st April 2006, 05:42 AM	#1
Alan62 Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 164	Help with possible origin I ran across this today and I can't seem to figure out what it is exactly or where is comes from.I know it's not a sword but you folks always seem to have answers on very difficult questions. The first thing that came to my mind was a Kubuki's drum or Tom Tom of some kind or perhaps some kind of religious drum.It appears to be oreintal. It is 4 inches thick and 10 inches across with paintings on both sides on what appears to be stretch skin of some kind.I will attach better pics when my camera is finished charging. Any ideas or oppinions welcomed and appreciated Thanks

1st April 2006, 09:03 AM	#5
yuanzhumin Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ex-Taipei, Taiwan, now in Shanghai, China Posts: 180	For me, mongolian Hello Living in a country of chinese culture, it is easy for me to recognize the chinese style and influence in this drum. Everything is chinese in the shape, the colors (red) and the traditional motives (dragon and phoenix, symbol for the emperor and the empress). But the way the drawing is made is different, something confirmed by the fact that the caracters drawn on it are not chinese, nor corean or japanese. So I guessed it was from a country very much influenced by China or even a minority inside China. The most obvious choice is Mongolia or the chinese region of Inner Mongolia. I checked the few caracters diplayed on the drums and they are definitly from the old mongolian writing. You can check by yourself through the following link: http://www.omniglot.com/writing/mongolian.htm One more thing, this traditional alphabet is not used anymore. It has been replaced in the 30's by latin and cyrillic alphabet. So I guess this drum has been made before the 30's. Hope this will help. Yuanzhumin

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1st April 2006, 06:04 AM	#2
Alan62 Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 164	The one side has a small hole But it is still a pretty cool piece

1st April 2006, 06:47 AM	#3
PUFF Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 30 miles north of Bangkok, 20 miles south of Ayuthaya, Thailand Posts: 224	The black rectangle in the last pic might help. Worth to take a close-up pic of the thing.

1st April 2006, 07:00 AM	#4
Alan62 Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 164	Thanks Puff ,Good thinking

1st April 2006, 10:16 AM	#6
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I remember seeing Tibetan praying wheels and armoires with similar designs and colors.

1st April 2006, 01:52 PM	#7
Alan62 Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 164	Thank You Yuanzhumin and Ariel, I do feel it is from before the 30s for sure as it shows definate signs of age. There is an oval with some letters, I think, on the other side but it is so faint that I cannot make it out. I have highlighted the oval with green dots and I think I see "RUSIN" if you look closely at the bottom of the oval.Maybe it is some kind of import mark or something

1st April 2006, 03:21 PM	#8
yuanzhumin Member Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: Ex-Taipei, Taiwan, now in Shanghai, China Posts: 180	I also thought of Tibet and even Mandchuria, whose writing is very similar for the neophyte like me. But after careful thinking, I abandonned the tibetan option. It's very subjective, I have to say. May be I'm completely wrong. But the fact that there is latin or even cyrillic letters on the other side of the drum could corroborate the mongolian option, in the 20's/30's.

1st April 2006, 03:59 PM	#9
Alan62 Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 164	Thank You Again Yuanzhumin