Two Large Mystery Knives

Ian · 11th January 2017, 12:49 AM

Hi drac:

Two interesting knives. The one with the hair (I agree it is probably goat hair) is probably mainland SE Asia or neighboring India/China. The S-shaped linked design adjacent to the spine of the blade is similar to northern Thai/Lao decorations seen on blades from the hill tribes. Like Detlef, I think the lettering on the blade resembles Burmese script, although the letters are incomplete. So a Kachin/Naga or nearby ethnic group seems most likely for that one.

The other one is more of a mystery. Judging from the ferrule and bolster I don't think this one is from the Philppines, although it has that general "flavor." Barry has suggested that the figure on the pommel is related to Buddhism, and he may be right. That would rule out the Philippines, and turn attention to mainland SE Asia, Tibet, etc. I'm having trouble pinning it down any further than that. Nice knife.

Ian.

drac2k · 11th January 2017, 03:36 AM

Again, the comments are appreciated.In regards to the one that Sajen thought could be Philippine, I did read that there was and is a Taoist-Buddhist community in the Philippines.The Vietnam Veteran could have gone there for "R & R," and this would not have been unusual.It does have a Philippine look with a Chinese influence.
I think my range has been expanded by all of the viable possibilities offered;i.e., Philippines, Tibet, etc.

kai · 11th January 2017, 12:26 PM

Hello Dave,

The temple guardian (?) head looks distinctly East Asian to me (EA Dhyana influence rather than Theravada or Tibetan Vajrayana). Considering the purported circumstances, my best bet would be that this knife originates with one of the many expat communities from southern Chinese coastal provinces: Maybe Cholon (Saigon), Bangkok, Manila, etc.

Regards,
Kai

kai · 11th January 2017, 01:26 PM

Sorry, double post.

drac2k · 11th January 2017, 02:37 PM

I like your theory.The U.S. Special Forces, the Green Berets, worked very closely with the Nung (jointly called 111 Corps Mike Force)."The Nungs were ethnic Chinese, who had at various times fled that country and had settled in and around Cholon, a suburb of Saigon ." I think you have put me on the right track!
The information on 111 Corps Mike Force and the Nung comes from an on line posting from the "Special Forces Association Chapter 1X: Vietnam - Green Berets and Nungs." I found this information prior to this posting while doing research on a machete, named to Capt. Thomas Myerchin , a commander of 111 Corps Mike Force, 3rd Nung Battalion, U.S. Army Special Forces.
Funny how different threads come together.

Sajen · 11th January 2017, 06:56 PM

The knife with the horn handle is indeed most interesting and I remember an old thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=Luzon
And Ian is correct, the ferrule isn't what point to the Philippines but maybe Chinese or Vietnam like the base of the blade. This base style you can find by Chinese daggers. So maybe indeed Vietnam?
And please can you take a flash picture from the handle? (close up)

Regards,
Detlef

drac2k · 11th January 2017, 08:18 PM

Wow Detlef, your recall is amazing ;give me a day or two and I will post more pictures of the handle.

kai · 11th January 2017, 08:37 PM

Hello Detlef,

Quote:

The knife with the horn handle is indeed most interesting and I remember an old thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=Luzon

Thanks for pointing this out! I believe the style does show way more differences than similarities though...

Quote:

And Ian is correct, the ferrule isn't what point to the Philippines but maybe Chinese or Vietnam like the base of the blade. This base style you can find by Chinese daggers. So maybe indeed Vietnam?

Mind you, it could be from any of the many, many China towns scattered all over SE Asia; it's just a matter of probabilities and my 3 suggestions would fit into the period (certainly several more possibilities within Southern Vietnam though depending on where the GI was stationed).

Regards,
Kai

KuKulzA28 · 12th January 2017, 06:26 AM

The second knife with the wrapping on the sheath reminds me of the type of wrapping often used by the Taiwanese aborigines of the western plains (Ping Pu) esp. with Han influence.

The mouth of the sheath reminds me of southern Chinese (guangdong, fujian, zheijiang) sheaths and scabbards...

the metal-work on that handle... not sure, but makes me think Chinese influenced SE Asian...

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search
Display Modes
Switch to Linear Mode Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

11th January 2017, 12:49 AM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,453	Hi drac: Two interesting knives. The one with the hair (I agree it is probably goat hair) is probably mainland SE Asia or neighboring India/China. The S-shaped linked design adjacent to the spine of the blade is similar to northern Thai/Lao decorations seen on blades from the hill tribes. Like Detlef, I think the lettering on the blade resembles Burmese script, although the letters are incomplete. So a Kachin/Naga or nearby ethnic group seems most likely for that one. The other one is more of a mystery. Judging from the ferrule and bolster I don't think this one is from the Philppines, although it has that general "flavor." Barry has suggested that the figure on the pommel is related to Buddhism, and he may be right. That would rule out the Philippines, and turn attention to mainland SE Asia, Tibet, etc. I'm having trouble pinning it down any further than that. Nice knife. Ian.

11th January 2017, 03:36 AM	#2
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,269	Again, the comments are appreciated.In regards to the one that Sajen thought could be Philippine, I did read that there was and is a Taoist-Buddhist community in the Philippines.The Vietnam Veteran could have gone there for "R & R," and this would not have been unusual.It does have a Philippine look with a Chinese influence. I think my range has been expanded by all of the viable possibilities offered;i.e., Philippines, Tibet, etc.

11th January 2017, 12:26 PM	#3
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Hello Dave, The temple guardian (?) head looks distinctly East Asian to me (EA Dhyana influence rather than Theravada or Tibetan Vajrayana). Considering the purported circumstances, my best bet would be that this knife originates with one of the many expat communities from southern Chinese coastal provinces: Maybe Cholon (Saigon), Bangkok, Manila, etc. Regards, Kai

11th January 2017, 01:26 PM	#4
kai Member Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 3,255	Sorry, double post.

11th January 2017, 02:37 PM	#5
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,269	I like your theory.The U.S. Special Forces, the Green Berets, worked very closely with the Nung (jointly called 111 Corps Mike Force)."The Nungs were ethnic Chinese, who had at various times fled that country and had settled in and around Cholon, a suburb of Saigon ." I think you have put me on the right track! The information on 111 Corps Mike Force and the Nung comes from an on line posting from the "Special Forces Association Chapter 1X: Vietnam - Green Berets and Nungs." I found this information prior to this posting while doing research on a machete, named to Capt. Thomas Myerchin , a commander of 111 Corps Mike Force, 3rd Nung Battalion, U.S. Army Special Forces. Funny how different threads come together.

11th January 2017, 06:56 PM	#6
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,272	The knife with the horn handle is indeed most interesting and I remember an old thread: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=Luzon And Ian is correct, the ferrule isn't what point to the Philippines but maybe Chinese or Vietnam like the base of the blade. This base style you can find by Chinese daggers. So maybe indeed Vietnam? And please can you take a flash picture from the handle? (close up) Regards, Detlef

11th January 2017, 08:18 PM	#7
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,269	Wow Detlef, your recall is amazing ;give me a day or two and I will post more pictures of the handle.

12th January 2017, 06:26 AM	#9
KuKulzA28 Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: between work and sleep Posts: 731	The second knife with the wrapping on the sheath reminds me of the type of wrapping often used by the Taiwanese aborigines of the western plains (Ping Pu) esp. with Han influence. The mouth of the sheath reminds me of southern Chinese (guangdong, fujian, zheijiang) sheaths and scabbards... the metal-work on that handle... not sure, but makes me think Chinese influenced SE Asian...