100 years after Groneman

Seerp Visser · 8th January 2017, 02:44 PM

I was very pleased when they invited me to have a look at the keris in real, especially since the museum is closed for a long period due to restoration work. I was allowed to measure and weigh the five keris. So I went to Vienna and found the famous five keris as they were taken from Yogjakarta.

Seerp Visser · 8th January 2017, 02:50 PM

No maintenance was done at all. They were like new, but looked very bad. One of the blades was damaged by taking a small piece for examination purposes.

Below I show a comparison of a photograph in the article of Dr. Groneman and a photograph of the same keris in the museum.
The left side of the picture shows the photograph of the keris in the article of Dr. Groneman in 1904.
At the right a photograph of the keris in the collection of the Weltmuseum.
The quality of both photographs is bad but it is still possible to compare the pamor and confirm that it is the same keris.

I hope the museum will have them well maintained and show them to the public when they reopen.
For us it will be very interesting to pay these historical famous keris a visit.

We may be very happy that 100 years after the dead of Dr. Groneman these five famous keris come alive again.

rasdan · 8th January 2017, 03:11 PM

A remarkable find indeed. Thank you very much for sharing this with us Seerp. I really appreciate it.

F. de Luzon · 8th January 2017, 03:32 PM

Impressive! Looks like you had quite an adventure. Congratulations on your discovery!

A. G. Maisey · 8th January 2017, 07:14 PM

Wonderful work Seerp.

I think I commented on the missing information from Groneman a few years ago, somebody who keeps track of posts to this Forum may be able to identify that post. I rather feel that Karja di Kromo himself probably excluded Groneman from the crucial sessions of work.

In recent times Empu Pauzan Pusposukadgo did a similar thing by publishing incomplete information in a booklet he published on how to make keris.

But this is history.

Your work in locating these keris is truly commendable.

Congratulations on a job well done.

David · 8th January 2017, 07:36 PM

Some impressive detective work indeed. I wonder though if this museum realizes the historical import of these keris in the same manner that we involved in the keris world do. I would hate to see them buried in their vaults when they re-open. Museums are also notorious for not giving proper care and maintenance to keris.

Sajen · 9th January 2017, 12:57 AM

Great work Seerp, thank you!

Paul Duffy · 11th January 2017, 10:29 PM

Seerp, I add my congratulations & thanks for rediscovering these pieces.
Regards,Paul

8th January 2017, 02:44 PM	#1
Seerp Visser Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Belgium Posts: 37	I was very pleased when they invited me to have a look at the keris in real, especially since the museum is closed for a long period due to restoration work. I was allowed to measure and weigh the five keris. So I went to Vienna and found the famous five keris as they were taken from Yogjakarta. Attached Images

8th January 2017, 02:50 PM	#2
Seerp Visser Member Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: Belgium Posts: 37	No maintenance was done at all. They were like new, but looked very bad. One of the blades was damaged by taking a small piece for examination purposes. Below I show a comparison of a photograph in the article of Dr. Groneman and a photograph of the same keris in the museum. The left side of the picture shows the photograph of the keris in the article of Dr. Groneman in 1904. At the right a photograph of the keris in the collection of the Weltmuseum. The quality of both photographs is bad but it is still possible to compare the pamor and confirm that it is the same keris. I hope the museum will have them well maintained and show them to the public when they reopen. For us it will be very interesting to pay these historical famous keris a visit. We may be very happy that 100 years after the dead of Dr. Groneman these five famous keris come alive again. Attached Images

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8th January 2017, 03:11 PM	#3
rasdan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Kuala Lumpur Posts: 369	A remarkable find indeed. Thank you very much for sharing this with us Seerp. I really appreciate it.

8th January 2017, 03:32 PM	#4
F. de Luzon Member Join Date: Dec 2016 Posts: 184	Impressive! Looks like you had quite an adventure. Congratulations on your discovery!

8th January 2017, 07:14 PM	#5
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,085	Wonderful work Seerp. I think I commented on the missing information from Groneman a few years ago, somebody who keeps track of posts to this Forum may be able to identify that post. I rather feel that Karja di Kromo himself probably excluded Groneman from the crucial sessions of work. In recent times Empu Pauzan Pusposukadgo did a similar thing by publishing incomplete information in a booklet he published on how to make keris. But this is history. Your work in locating these keris is truly commendable. Congratulations on a job well done.

8th January 2017, 07:36 PM	#6
David Keris forum moderator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Nova Scotia Posts: 7,250	Some impressive detective work indeed. I wonder though if this museum realizes the historical import of these keris in the same manner that we involved in the keris world do. I would hate to see them buried in their vaults when they re-open. Museums are also notorious for not giving proper care and maintenance to keris.

9th January 2017, 12:57 AM	#7
Sajen Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Germany, Dortmund Posts: 9,415	Great work Seerp, thank you!

11th January 2017, 10:29 PM	#8
Paul Duffy Member Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 31	Seerp, I add my congratulations & thanks for rediscovering these pieces. Regards,Paul