St. Peter's Dagger

Ian · 7th August 2014, 12:16 AM

Given the Venetian connection with its location in St. Mark's Cathedral, could this knife be celebrating the works of St. Peter Orseolo? The man rose through a military career to become Doge of Venice, rebuilt St. Mark's at his own expense, then chucked it all in for the life of a monk. His life considerably predates this knife, however.

"Peter Orseolo, of Rivo Alto, Italy, served as commander of the Venetian navy before becoming Doge of Venice in 976. In this office he rebuilt the fire-ravaged Saint Mark’s Cathedral, funding the work from his own wealth. From Constantinople he obtained for the cathedral’s high altar what is considered the earliest known example of a gold altar cloth. He also founded a hospice for pilgrims. But after governing for only two years, Peter suddenly disappeared from the city during the night of September 1-2, 978. He fled his prestigious station to devote the rest of his life to God, traveling over five hundred miles westward to enter the Benedictine monastery of Cuxa, at the foot of the eastern Pyrenees, along the French-Spanish border. As he neared the monastery, Peter took off his shoes and walked the remaining steps of the journey bare-footed. As a monk, he excelled in humility, devotion to prayer, charity, and self-denial. Thereafter, Peter’s zeal for even greater perfection prompted him to obtain permission to live in solitude a short distance from the monastery." (see http://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=5620)

Ian.

Jim McDougall · 7th August 2014, 01:39 AM

Excellent alternative solution which has been well presented, and of course may well be the case as the location in which it is held certainly seems to have associated significance. It does not seem that the period of the knife itself not necessarily aligned with that of the Saint himself should be a factor as these appear to be votive relics. It is unfortunate they do not offer more substantial data in describing the piece, as it is quite apparent there is more than one St.Peter.

Oliver Pinchot · 7th August 2014, 04:57 PM

Gentlemen,

The form of the blade and chiseled motifs, fullering and the shape of the grip all support a mid-late 15th century Ottoman attribution. I wish the pic was clearer; the motifs decorating the grip would prove illuminating.

Oliver

A. G. Maisey · 7th August 2014, 10:53 PM

Oliver, we're lucky to have any photo at all.

Photos in this part of the Basilica are strictly forbidden.

David · 8th August 2014, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oliver Pinchot

I wish the pic was clearer; the motifs decorating the grip would prove illuminating.

Oliver, i've turned it B&W and opened up a the shadows a bit. Not ideal, but it may help a little.

Oliver Pinchot · 8th August 2014, 03:14 AM

It's certainly a help, David, thanks!
Alan, did you take the pic? Wondering how large it is.

Battara · 8th August 2014, 04:40 AM

Good point - does feel Ottoman.

A. G. Maisey · 8th August 2014, 05:04 AM

Its in a glass case, I'd guess maybe 15", end to end.

7th August 2014, 12:16 AM	#1
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,749	Perhaps St. Peter Orseolo Given the Venetian connection with its location in St. Mark's Cathedral, could this knife be celebrating the works of St. Peter Orseolo? The man rose through a military career to become Doge of Venice, rebuilt St. Mark's at his own expense, then chucked it all in for the life of a monk. His life considerably predates this knife, however. "Peter Orseolo, of Rivo Alto, Italy, served as commander of the Venetian navy before becoming Doge of Venice in 976. In this office he rebuilt the fire-ravaged Saint Mark’s Cathedral, funding the work from his own wealth. From Constantinople he obtained for the cathedral’s high altar what is considered the earliest known example of a gold altar cloth. He also founded a hospice for pilgrims. But after governing for only two years, Peter suddenly disappeared from the city during the night of September 1-2, 978. He fled his prestigious station to devote the rest of his life to God, traveling over five hundred miles westward to enter the Benedictine monastery of Cuxa, at the foot of the eastern Pyrenees, along the French-Spanish border. As he neared the monastery, Peter took off his shoes and walked the remaining steps of the journey bare-footed. As a monk, he excelled in humility, devotion to prayer, charity, and self-denial. Thereafter, Peter’s zeal for even greater perfection prompted him to obtain permission to live in solitude a short distance from the monastery." (see http://www.catholic.org/saints/saint.php?saint_id=5620) Ian. Last edited by Ian; 7th August 2014 at 12:34 AM.

7th August 2014, 04:57 PM	#3
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 478	Gentlemen, The form of the blade and chiseled motifs, fullering and the shape of the grip all support a mid-late 15th century Ottoman attribution. I wish the pic was clearer; the motifs decorating the grip would prove illuminating. Oliver Last edited by Oliver Pinchot; 7th August 2014 at 05:24 PM.

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7th August 2014, 01:39 AM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,872	Excellent alternative solution which has been well presented, and of course may well be the case as the location in which it is held certainly seems to have associated significance. It does not seem that the period of the knife itself not necessarily aligned with that of the Saint himself should be a factor as these appear to be votive relics. It is unfortunate they do not offer more substantial data in describing the piece, as it is quite apparent there is more than one St.Peter.

7th August 2014, 10:53 PM	#4
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,263	Oliver, we're lucky to have any photo at all. Photos in this part of the Basilica are strictly forbidden.

8th August 2014, 03:14 AM	#6
Oliver Pinchot Member Join Date: Sep 2012 Posts: 478	It's certainly a help, David, thanks! Alan, did you take the pic? Wondering how large it is.

8th August 2014, 04:40 AM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,423	Good point - does feel Ottoman.

8th August 2014, 05:04 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,263	Its in a glass case, I'd guess maybe 15", end to end.