Help Identifying a Kindjal/Qama Type and Its Origin

[ALEX]

The year is 1326 A.H. = 1908 A.D. (depending on calculation system used).
The wheel is a "wheel of life" - quite predominant element in Islamic art.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by ALEX

The year is 1326 A.H. = 1908 A.D. (depending on calculation system used).
The wheel is a "wheel of life" - quite predominant element in Islamic art.

Alex, spot on the date. I was trying to recall it by memory and should have known better! Thanks again for all your input.

[ariel]

South-West Georgia, the Gurian region, border with Turkey, thus the mix of elements. Subsequently, this outline was adopted by the Black Sea Cossack Host.

Check the fullers: old ones had the most beautiful "Tiflis" damaskus pattern.

I have a suspicion ( and please reassure me that I am wrong!) that the tip was broken and re-formed. Usually, this type has rounded and stubby tip; this one is somehow awkward: straight lines.Check the length of the blade and the scabbard: I have a feeling that it is an inch or two too short for his breeches :-)

[eftihis]

Hello, once in the past, on a discussion about the "black sea yataghan", i posted this photofrom the book "The industrial heritage of costume design in Turkey" by Pr. Onder Kucukerman. On page 60, there is the photo showing "clothing of muslim villagers and townspeople", in Trabzon 1870. This city is in Laz area of the black sea, or "Pontos" as we call it in Greek. It shows the same type of kinjal.

[ariel]

Agree with Eftihis. This entire area was a hodge-podge of multiple Caucasian, Turkish and Greek styles. Although it gave rise to peculiarly idiosyncratic weapons, which is a topic in its own right.
When the Auctions Imperial sale is over, I might bring some examples :-)

And as to dating of Islamic objects, I found nothing better than that:

http://www.oriold.uzh.ch/static/hegira.html

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by ariel

South-West Georgia, the Gurian region, border with Turkey, thus the mix of elements. Subsequently, this outline was adopted by the Black Sea Cossack Host.

Check the fullers: old ones had the most beautiful "Tiflis" damaskus pattern.

I have a suspicion ( and please reassure me that I am wrong!) that the tip was broken and re-formed. Usually, this type has rounded and stubby tip; this one is somehow awkward: straight lines.Check the length of the blade and the scabbard: I have a feeling that it is an inch or two too short for his breeches :-)

Thanks Ariel, as always, for you input.

I don't think the fullers here are Damascus, but need a magnifier as they are so dark. I have to also assume that 1908 would be "later" for one of these.

I have checked on the blade vs. scabbard length, and can't imagine that the blade could be any longer, especially considering that the wooden inner liner would be even shorter than what we are seeing. The outside measurement puts the blade at just over 1/2in. away from the chape's finial.

The blade may be a bit of an oddball, but I do believe both the scabbard and the blade were born together as is.

Thanks again for your input and comments.