Help with yatagans' inscriptions

[TVV]

Zifir, tahnk you very much Sir!
I think your suggestion regarding the date makes a lot of sense. My friend will be happy with an early yatagan, but from what I have seen (and I have only seen pictures), I doubt this yatagan is 18th century.
Best regards,
Teodor

[TVV]

Zifir, Dom and others who can read Arabic, can you please help with the inscriptions on this yataghan?

Thank you very much in advance,

Teodor

[TVV]

Here is another yataghan with nice inscitpions from Bulgaria - can anyone help translate them?

Many thanks in advance,
Teodor

[Dom]

Hi Teo

except a date, 1288 (1871 gregorian calendar)
and a sentence; la fatha ela Ali, la Saïf ela Zulfakar
no boy than Ali, no sword than Zulfakar

not possibilty to translate the others inscriptions, from Arab to an another language,
because, it's what ever you want excepted arabic language

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Thank you very much Dom,

I guess the top row is most likely in Turkish.

Regards,
Teodor

[Zifir]

Hi,
The first one is:

Amel-i Şerif Sahib Osman Ağazade Abdülcemil

Work of Şerif, Owner Abdülcemil, son of Osman Agha

The first line of the second script was difficult to give meaning for me although there is no difficulty in reading it.

Kendi nutk-ı pakdır nutk eyleyen Perverdegar


(My somehow nonsensical translation is: He himself is a well spoken word since it is Allah who make him speak. Some Sufi references here that I am not familiar)

that's best I can

[TVV]

Zifir,

Thank you very much, I really appreciate your translation.
The line with the Sufi reference is especially intriguing, and since almost all inscriptions had an important, almost talismanic meaning to the original owners of these blades, I wonder how it should be interpreted.

Best regards,
Teodor

[TVV]

Here is a yataghan recently found in Bulgaria - 96 cm long, which is not common, with a Balkan hilt and likely an Anatolian blade, with interesting inscriptions in 3 circles on one side. Can someone translate the inscriptions? I think I see a date 1260, or 1844 in Gregorian.

Thank you very much!
Teodor

[Dom]

Originally Posted by TVV

Can someone translate the inscriptions? I think I see a date 1260, or 1844 in Gregorian.

Hi Teodor
quality of pic ..
- too far, please use "focus" fonction
- about the date, I agree with you 1260 H. (Persian writting)

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Originally Posted by Dom

Hi Teodor
quality of pic ..
- too far, please use "focus" fonction
- about the date, I agree with you 1260 H. (Persian writting)

à +

Dom

Dom,

Thank you for the quick response. The yataghan is located half the world away from me and neither it, nor the pictures are mine - I posted it here at the request of its owner. I will see what I can do.

Teodor

[TVV]

Ok, some more pictures of the inscriptions on this yataghan. The more I look into these, the less sure I am they are legible, but I would appreciate if anyone gives it a try.

Again, thank you in advance.

Teodor

[ariel]

Teodor,
I really enjoyed this thread . Thank you and the rest of the gang for posting them.
Regarding yours with the rhino handle.
There is a cavity between the cheeks. I do not think I have seen such a completely "disassembled" handle before. Anybody knows whether this space in yataghans in general was filled with some kind of putty or was the handle hollow inside and kept by rivets only? Of course, they all had some kind of metal ribbon around the entire handle.

[Gavin Nugent]

Originally Posted by ariel

Teodor,
I really enjoyed this thread . Thank you and the rest of the gang for posting them.
Regarding yours with the rhino handle.
There is a cavity between the cheeks. I do not think I have seen such a completely "disassembled" handle before. Anybody knows whether this space in yataghans in general was filled with some kind of putty or was the handle hollow inside and kept by rivets only? Of course, they all had some kind of metal ribbon around the entire handle.

I have had two Yats with portions of the grip strap missing and neither of them were filled, just the rivets holding the slabs against the strapping....the kilij seen here;

http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=13639

Also has a grip strap that requires attaching to the top and bottom near the guard and it too is not filled in completely, just appears that what has oozed past the tang during original application has fallen in the gap....perhaps a standard Turkish method of manufacture.

[TVV]

Thank you Ariel. I believe Gav is correct - usual hilt construction on yataghans, including those with metal hilts is that the scales are not glued to the tang, but are held by rivets only, and this hollow space is covered by the metal band in the middle of the hilt. There are probably exceptions, but the majority of the damaged hilts I have seen follow this method of attachment.

My guess is that this was done to preserve scarce hilt material, such as walrus ivory, and to create an illusion that the scales were carved out of a giant piece of ivory or horn.

Regards,
Teodor

[Dom]

Originally Posted by TVV

Ok, some more pictures of the inscriptions on this yataghan. The more I look into these, the less sure I am they are legible, but I would appreciate if anyone gives it a try.

Again, thank you in advance.

Teodor

Hi Teodor
Tks for pic's, they are exploitables, and at first view, could be possible to get something, at least ... some
just need few time, we'll be absent until May 2nd, be patient and optimistic

à +

Dom

just a taste ....

SANA 1290 either YEAR 1873

Cheers

[TVV]

Thank you Dom, I promise to stay patient and optimistic.
Teodor

[Zifir]

Hi,
I could only read this part, but I am very curious about the circles. This is the first time I see such circles on a yatağan. Although I cannot read it, there are arabic letters and symbols inside the circles which I am not very familiar. Also if I remember correctly, I have seen the symbol, in which amel-i Halil is written, in elsewhere and somebody claimed it to be a Bektashi symbol.

[TVV]

Thank you very much Zifir,

This is very helpful. I have also seen the symbol one other yataghan blades, even though it is not a very common one. I did not know of its significance by now though. I gues if it is indeed a Bektashi symbol, this would simply mean that the owner or the maker (Halil) has some sort of a Janissary connection.

Hopefully, we will be able to learn more about the circles at some point.

Regards,
Teodor

[Dom]

hi
as well as Zifir, we cannot read it, the arabic letters and symbols inside the circles.
precision might be bring:
- AMEL means => the blacksmith
- SAHAB (SAHEB) means => the owner

on the pic jointed, has been translated
HUSSAIN SAHAB either OWNER HUSSAIN
very sorry to don't be more efficient

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Thank you Dom, I appreciate it.

The circles are quite unique, but maybe they exist on another blade, in a more legible form. If such a blade surfaces at some point in the future, it may help with the translation of this one. Or at least this is all we can hope for.

Thanks again Dom and Zifir for your help.

Teodor

[TVV]

My Bulgarian friend, who collects yataghans, has asked me to post three of his latest acquisitions here with the hope of getting the blade inscriptions translated.
Many thanks in advance,
Teodor

[Zifir]

Hi Teodor,
Pretty standard inscriptions, accompanied by my haphazard translations

Best,

[TVV]

Zifir, thank you very much, excellent as always. I really appreciate the effort you have put in placing the translation text on the pictures: this thread is slowly becoming a database of inscriptions.
Regards,
Teodor

[David R]

Perhaps I should post my Yataghan here as well, to make it a one stop archive. My apologies if this is redundant, If I had seen this thread earlier I would have posted here only. The buffalo horn grip scales are a replacement made by me in a style I am familiar with from a yataghan I owned some years ago. The originals were gone, and had been replaced with painted plaster.

[TVV]

Here is yet another yataghan blade insription for translation, many thanks in advance.
Teodor

[TVV]

While waiting for th translation on the rpevious one, here is another yataghan with a similar in style (as far as it is applied to the blade) inscription.

Thank you in advance,
Teodor

[TVV]

Hopefully Zifir or someone else will be able to help with the inscriptions from my previous two posts. In the meantime, I am going to add another yataghan with an inscription that needs translation t the archive in this thread.

Thank you,
Teodor

[Dom]

Originally Posted by TVV

Hopefully Zifir or someone else will be able to help with the inscriptions from my previous two posts.

Hi Teodor
unfortunately, it's only Zifir who is able to translate the Turkish "ancient"
Zifir is a professor in university,
they are may be in examinations period ?
also be patient and keep fingers crossed

à +

Dom

[TVV]

Thank you for responding Dom,
I am grateful for all the help that Zifir and the other translators, like your spouse, have provided in this forum. These inscriptions have remained on the blades for centuries and will be there for many more years, so there is no particular hurry. I am sure that when Zifi comes by the forum, he will look at them. In the meantime, I am simply adding further examples to this thread as they come up.
Teodor

[TVV]

Here are three photos of inscriptions and a maker's mark on yataghan blades. I received them from a friend in Bulgaria with a plea for translation. I apologize for not having photos of the entire yataghans: I am trying to obtain those shots. However, in light of contributing so many yataghans to this forum, I hope that I may be granted an exception in this case from our gracious translators.

As always, all help in translating these inscriptions and marks is greatly appreciated.

Thank you,
Teodor