Sword club where from??

VANDOO · 29th March 2012, 03:40 PM

THIS IS CLOSE TO THE DESIGN OF THE MAORI STAFF/SPEAR WEAPON TAHIATA. I SUSPECT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN USED IN THE SAME FASHON. THE FLAT ROUNDED END FOR STRIKING LIKE A SWORD BLADE AND THE POINTED HEAVY END FOR THRUSTING LIKE A SPEAR. THERE IS NO CARVING AND THERE ARE DIFFERENCES IN FORM FROM THE MAORI WEAPON BUT THERE IS MUCH IN COMMON IN FORM AND DESIGN FOR FIGHTING STYLE.
I DOUBT IT WAS GRIPPED IN THE FASHON SHOWN IN THE PHOTO TRY THE AREA OF THE SHAFT CLOSEST TO THE SPEAR END AND CHECK BALANCE OF THE WEAPON USING A TWO HANDED GRIP AS THE MAORI DO. THIS DESIGN IS FOR FAST BLOCKING AND STRIKING AS WELL AS THRUSTING WITH BOTH ENDS. NICE LOOKING CLUB PERHAPS A UNFINISHED MAORI CLUB OR ONE INFLUENCED BY THE MAORI FORM. IT IS SHORT FOR A TAHIATA PERHAPS ONE FOR A YOUNG MAN TO PRACTICE WITH HENCE NO CARVED DESIGNS. ITS PROBABLY A BIT LONG FOR PHILIPPINE CLUBS?.

kahnjar1 · 29th March 2012, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VANDOO

THIS IS CLOSE TO THE DESIGN OF THE MAORI STAFF/SPEAR WEAPON TAHIATA. I SUSPECT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN USED IN THE SAME FASHON. THE FLAT ROUNDED END FOR STRIKING LIKE A SWORD BLADE AND THE POINTED HEAVY END FOR THRUSTING LIKE A SPEAR. THERE IS NO CARVING AND THERE ARE DIFFERENCES IN FORM FROM THE MAORI WEAPON BUT THERE IS MUCH IN COMMON IN FORM AND DESIGN FOR FIGHTING STYLE.
I DOUBT IT WAS GRIPPED IN THE FASHON SHOWN IN THE PHOTO TRY THE AREA OF THE SHAFT CLOSEST TO THE SPEAR END AND CHECK BALANCE OF THE WEAPON USING A TWO HANDED GRIP AS THE MAORI DO. THIS DESIGN IS FOR FAST BLOCKING AND STRIKING AS WELL AS THRUSTING WITH BOTH ENDS. NICE LOOKING CLUB PERHAPS A UNFINISHED MAORI CLUB OR ONE INFLUENCED BY THE MAORI FORM. IT IS SHORT FOR A TAHIATA PERHAPS ONE FOR A YOUNG MAN TO PRACTICE WITH HENCE NO CARVED DESIGNS. ITS PROBABLY A BIT LONG FOR PHILIPPINE CLUBS?.

Definately not a Taiaha...pic attached....and I very much doubt Maori.(too plain) Barry's reference to "practice sticks" could be correct but such sticks used for Taiaha practice were just usually plain lengths of a suitable tree branch, and full length.
Regards Stu

Tim Simmons · 29th March 2012, 06:08 PM

I too do or should I say did doubt this is a Taiaha. However I have found this New Zealand link which is exactly the same size as my item.

http://www.antiquesreporter.com.au/i...-having-a-car/

I am still very unsure about the type of wood and the finish with a gum/resin lacquer. Also as Stu has mentioned the lack of decoration. I still think it is a weapon though.

kahnjar1 · 29th March 2012, 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

I too do or should I say did doubt this is a Taiaha. However I have found this New Zealand link which is exactly the same size as my item.

http://www.antiquesreporter.com.au/i...-having-a-car/

I am still very unsure about the type of wood and the finish with a gum/resin lacquer. Also as Stu has mentioned the lack of decoration. I still think it is a weapon though.

That is a Taiaha but you are looking at the pic from the "business end". The plain end furthest away as you look at the pic is the handle end.
Stu

Tim Simmons · 29th March 2012, 06:45 PM

If you ignore the fancy decoration. They are indeed remarkably similar. Perhaps the status of the owner may have a bearing on the quality of finish, if it is a childs Taiaha?

Another thing it looks very much like a palm wood. The Maori did use Nikau palm wood for many things like flooring. I have not been able to get any images of Nikau palm wood timber.

Tim Simmons · 29th March 2012, 07:41 PM

After some research it seems that there were indeed shorter versions of Taiaha and Pouwhenua, also varriations on the Society, Austral and Cook Islands. So just perhaps it is rather a good thing.

fearn · 29th March 2012, 08:43 PM

Gentlemen,

As I understand it, taiahas don't have midribs. They are rounded in cross section, unlike Tim's club. REALLY unlike Tim's club. As for their ancestry, there are similar clubs here and there throughout Polynesia. It's an old design.

From the pictures, it doesn't particularly look like palm wood, but I could be wrong. Palm wood has longitudinal fibers, but it doesn't have rays or growth rings I see evidence both of those in this specimen, which suggests to me that it's from a broadleaf tree. (Explanation growth rings should be obvious. Rays are lines of cells in the wood that connect the different growth rings, and run perpendicular both to the length of the trunk and the circumference of the growth rings, if that makes sense).

I'm sticking with the Philippines on this one. It's a wooden sword.

F

29th March 2012, 06:45 PM	#5
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,890	If you ignore the fancy decoration. They are indeed remarkably similar. Perhaps the status of the owner may have a bearing on the quality of finish, if it is a childs Taiaha? Another thing it looks very much like a palm wood. The Maori did use Nikau palm wood for many things like flooring. I have not been able to get any images of Nikau palm wood timber. Last edited by Tim Simmons; 29th March 2012 at 07:17 PM.

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29th March 2012, 03:40 PM	#1
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THIS IS CLOSE TO THE DESIGN OF THE MAORI STAFF/SPEAR WEAPON TAHIATA. I SUSPECT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN USED IN THE SAME FASHON. THE FLAT ROUNDED END FOR STRIKING LIKE A SWORD BLADE AND THE POINTED HEAVY END FOR THRUSTING LIKE A SPEAR. THERE IS NO CARVING AND THERE ARE DIFFERENCES IN FORM FROM THE MAORI WEAPON BUT THERE IS MUCH IN COMMON IN FORM AND DESIGN FOR FIGHTING STYLE. I DOUBT IT WAS GRIPPED IN THE FASHON SHOWN IN THE PHOTO TRY THE AREA OF THE SHAFT CLOSEST TO THE SPEAR END AND CHECK BALANCE OF THE WEAPON USING A TWO HANDED GRIP AS THE MAORI DO. THIS DESIGN IS FOR FAST BLOCKING AND STRIKING AS WELL AS THRUSTING WITH BOTH ENDS. NICE LOOKING CLUB PERHAPS A UNFINISHED MAORI CLUB OR ONE INFLUENCED BY THE MAORI FORM. IT IS SHORT FOR A TAHIATA PERHAPS ONE FOR A YOUNG MAN TO PRACTICE WITH HENCE NO CARVED DESIGNS. ITS PROBABLY A BIT LONG FOR PHILIPPINE CLUBS?.

29th March 2012, 06:08 PM	#3
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,890	I too do or should I say did doubt this is a Taiaha. However I have found this New Zealand link which is exactly the same size as my item. http://www.antiquesreporter.com.au/i...-having-a-car/ I am still very unsure about the type of wood and the finish with a gum/resin lacquer. Also as Stu has mentioned the lack of decoration. I still think it is a weapon though.

29th March 2012, 07:41 PM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,890	After some research it seems that there were indeed shorter versions of Taiaha and Pouwhenua, also varriations on the Society, Austral and Cook Islands. So just perhaps it is rather a good thing.

29th March 2012, 08:43 PM	#7
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Gentlemen, As I understand it, taiahas don't have midribs. They are rounded in cross section, unlike Tim's club. REALLY unlike Tim's club. As for their ancestry, there are similar clubs here and there throughout Polynesia. It's an old design. From the pictures, it doesn't particularly look like palm wood, but I could be wrong. Palm wood has longitudinal fibers, but it doesn't have rays or growth rings I see evidence both of those in this specimen, which suggests to me that it's from a broadleaf tree. (Explanation growth rings should be obvious. Rays are lines of cells in the wood that connect the different growth rings, and run perpendicular both to the length of the trunk and the circumference of the growth rings, if that makes sense). I'm sticking with the Philippines on this one. It's a wooden sword. F