Huge navaja

Yannis · 30th July 2006, 04:08 PM

It was the biggest navaja I had seen before Artzi posted in his site a real monster! Still is very big. Open is 49 cm! A small sword.

Hilt has four thick panels of polished bone with faded scrimshaw (?). One side is floral and other side has two men. Blade is very clean with etched flora one side and a man on the other side. There is a long and thin chip in one of the bone panels (clearly in the photos).

When blade is open it is very difficult to close it again, so I use another blade or screwdriver to do it. Someone with proper tools may fix it. A real and rare antique. Price $480 with free registered shipping.

Chris Evans · 1st August 2006, 03:28 AM

Hi Yannis,

It is a French souvenir or display navaja, as indicated by the very large and etched blade. Yes, they can be a bit hard to close. Most of the display navajas are in good order because they were not meant to be used and as such represent very good value, especially this one.

Is it a "teat" lock? Seems to be.

Cheers
Chris

Yannis · 1st August 2006, 10:02 AM

Chris
Thank you for the info. I don’t know much about navajas. It is antique so I never thought about “display”. But it is possible. It is very ornate for a peasant’s weapon. And for sure it has quality and hand made work on it.
The lock has a pin that goes in a hole. The metal where the hole is has to be straight again to make it easy in closing.
Can you please estimate the age? From patina I say it is at least 80 years old. After your opinion price drops to $340.

Chris Evans · 1st August 2006, 10:35 AM

Hi Yannis,

According to Forton's "Navajas Antiguas", the standard reference book for collectors, that is a French navaja from Chatellerault, and dating from the middle of the 19tch century. In my opinion it could be a bit later, but is almost certain to have been made before 1900.

Re the lock: From your description,it it is a""teat lock"; The teat being that metal protrusin that engages with the back spring. It was customary to fit the back-spring with a ring that could be pulled with the finger and disengage the lock more easily. I wouldn't be surprised if yours was originally fitted with one and subsequently lost.

Contrary to the wishful thinking of incurable romantics, most utility navaja, those intended for actual use, rarely had blades in excess of 9", most being in the range of 5"-8. Reason being that once a blade went over 9"or so, the assembly became very weak and the folder broke easily, usually at the hinge. Of course handles could be made robust, but then they became too heavy and cumbersome. Once one sees decorative etching on the blade, it is near certain that the knife was intended to serve as a display piece or souvenir. Most large navajas were of this ilk.

That knife, assuming that it is in as fine condition as what the photos suggest, is worth a fair bit of money. If you want to get an idea as to how much similar knives retail for, I suggest that you visit this website from time to time:
http://www.knivescollection.com/cata..._antichi_e.asp

Cheers
Chris

Yannis · 1st August 2006, 11:13 AM

Thank you Chris! Very useful info and very good link. I have another navaja that is not for sale so I will post it in the main forum. Please take a look at it and give me your opinion.

Yannis · 1st August 2006, 11:47 AM

After some thought I decided to post the other navaja here. It is for sale as I want only one navaja. So the after one of them is sold the other stops to be for sale.
This knife has 3 tortoise panels on the hilt and one made from black horn. 8 small mother of pearl inlays (one missing). Fine constructed and very old. It is also long, 40cm. No cracks, chips etc.

Chris please your opinion, it is always good to learn

Chris Evans · 2nd August 2006, 02:16 AM

Hi Yannis,

Another Frenchie - This time from Thiers. Forton simply refers to it as 19th century. My guess is that it was made in the second half of that century.

Lock appears to be what I call a demi-lock, that is, the blade can be closed by downward pressure alone, though a considerable force has to be exerted.

Knives like these were very popular in Spain, where they largely displaced the native product on account of better quality, price and the absence of a full lock, which was illegal in most jurisdictions. The issue of the lock, as the lethal thrust depends on having one, was central to Spanish legislation governing folding knives ever since the 18th century when the navaja made its appearance due to the then newly enacted weapon bans.

Cheers
Chris

Yannis · 2nd August 2006, 09:13 AM

Thank you very much

Yannis · 10th October 2006, 11:12 AM

I wanted to give one of these, because I didn’t wanted 2 navajas. But now I found a 3rd. So both of them are to go. Price falls to 280 each, shipping included.

30th July 2006, 04:08 PM	#1
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	Huge navaja It was the biggest navaja I had seen before Artzi posted in his site a real monster! Still is very big. Open is 49 cm! A small sword. Hilt has four thick panels of polished bone with faded scrimshaw (?). One side is floral and other side has two men. Blade is very clean with etched flora one side and a man on the other side. There is a long and thin chip in one of the bone panels (clearly in the photos). When blade is open it is very difficult to close it again, so I use another blade or screwdriver to do it. Someone with proper tools may fix it. A real and rare antique. Price $480 with free registered shipping. Attached Images

1st August 2006, 11:47 AM	#6
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	After some thought I decided to post the other navaja here. It is for sale as I want only one navaja. So the after one of them is sold the other stops to be for sale. This knife has 3 tortoise panels on the hilt and one made from black horn. 8 small mother of pearl inlays (one missing). Fine constructed and very old. It is also long, 40cm. No cracks, chips etc. Chris please your opinion, it is always good to learn Attached Images

1st August 2006, 03:28 AM	#2
Chris Evans Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 676	Hi Yannis, It is a French souvenir or display navaja, as indicated by the very large and etched blade. Yes, they can be a bit hard to close. Most of the display navajas are in good order because they were not meant to be used and as such represent very good value, especially this one. Is it a "teat" lock? Seems to be. Cheers Chris

1st August 2006, 10:02 AM	#3
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	Chris Thank you for the info. I don’t know much about navajas. It is antique so I never thought about “display”. But it is possible. It is very ornate for a peasant’s weapon. And for sure it has quality and hand made work on it. The lock has a pin that goes in a hole. The metal where the hole is has to be straight again to make it easy in closing. Can you please estimate the age? From patina I say it is at least 80 years old. After your opinion price drops to $340.

1st August 2006, 10:35 AM	#4
Chris Evans Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 676	Hi Yannis, According to Forton's "Navajas Antiguas", the standard reference book for collectors, that is a French navaja from Chatellerault, and dating from the middle of the 19tch century. In my opinion it could be a bit later, but is almost certain to have been made before 1900. Re the lock: From your description,it it is a""teat lock"; The teat being that metal protrusin that engages with the back spring. It was customary to fit the back-spring with a ring that could be pulled with the finger and disengage the lock more easily. I wouldn't be surprised if yours was originally fitted with one and subsequently lost. Contrary to the wishful thinking of incurable romantics, most utility navaja, those intended for actual use, rarely had blades in excess of 9", most being in the range of 5"-8. Reason being that once a blade went over 9"or so, the assembly became very weak and the folder broke easily, usually at the hinge. Of course handles could be made robust, but then they became too heavy and cumbersome. Once one sees decorative etching on the blade, it is near certain that the knife was intended to serve as a display piece or souvenir. Most large navajas were of this ilk. That knife, assuming that it is in as fine condition as what the photos suggest, is worth a fair bit of money. If you want to get an idea as to how much similar knives retail for, I suggest that you visit this website from time to time: http://www.knivescollection.com/cata..._antichi_e.asp Cheers Chris

1st August 2006, 11:13 AM	#5
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	Thank you Chris! Very useful info and very good link. I have another navaja that is not for sale so I will post it in the main forum. Please take a look at it and give me your opinion.

2nd August 2006, 02:16 AM	#7
Chris Evans Member Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Australia Posts: 676	Hi Yannis, Another Frenchie - This time from Thiers. Forton simply refers to it as 19th century. My guess is that it was made in the second half of that century. Lock appears to be what I call a demi-lock, that is, the blade can be closed by downward pressure alone, though a considerable force has to be exerted. Knives like these were very popular in Spain, where they largely displaced the native product on account of better quality, price and the absence of a full lock, which was illegal in most jurisdictions. The issue of the lock, as the lethal thrust depends on having one, was central to Spanish legislation governing folding knives ever since the 18th century when the navaja made its appearance due to the then newly enacted weapon bans. Cheers Chris

2nd August 2006, 09:13 AM	#8
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	Thank you very much

10th October 2006, 11:12 AM	#9
Yannis Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Athens Greece Posts: 479	I wanted to give one of these, because I didn’t wanted 2 navajas. But now I found a 3rd. So both of them are to go. Price falls to 280 each, shipping included.