Philippine monosteel Blades. Preserving and restoring

[oldschldude]

Hello Everyone,
I would like to ask what is monosteel(Philippine monosteel blades)? What's its history? Made of? Automobile coil? Leafspring? Can you age the blade if its monosteel construction? How do you get rid of rust on monosteel blade? Does the same rust removal techniques for laminated blades apply? Polishing and etching? Would you apply vinegar or other etching acids(citric acids or Fecl) to a rusty monosteel blade? Thanks! Oldschldude

Blade dark spot early rust.
Slightly surface rust.
Pitted rust spots.
Crusty rust whole blade.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by oldschldude

Hello Everyone,
I would like to ask what is monosteel(Philippine monosteel blades)? What's its history? Made of? Automobile coil? Leafspring? Can you age the blade if its monosteel construction? How do you get rid of rust on monosteel blade? Does the same rust removal techniques for laminated blades apply? Polishing and etching? Would you apply vinegar or other etching acids(citric acids or Fecl) to a rusty monosteel blade? Thanks! Oldschldude

Blade dark spot early rust.
Slightly surface rust.
Pitted rust spots.
Crusty rust whole blade.

Pictures? They would help.

Regards,
Detlef

[blue lander]

I have a WWII era monosteel Barong, the seller said the steel came from a downed Japanese fighter plane. I have no reason to believe this is true though.

[Timo Nieminen]

Originally Posted by oldschldude

Leafspring?

For weapons, that's the traditional source of the steel.

[estcrh]

Originally Posted by oldschldude

Hello Everyone, I would like to ask what is monosteel

The term "mono steel" is used to describe blades that show no sign of watering / lamination etc. The source of the mono steel is usually not easliy determinable unless you know what type of steel the smith used.

[Sajen]

Agree, when you don't have polished and etched the blade you can't know if the blade is monosteel. So my first post where I've asked for pictures.
I have some Luzon blades which seems to be worked from rasps. You never will be able to tell which steel is used until you have cleaned and etched the blade.
See for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=luzon

Regards,
Detlef

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by oldschldude

Hello Everyone,
I would like to ask what is monosteel(Philippine monosteel blades)? What's its history? Made of? Automobile coil? Leafspring? Can you age the blade if its monosteel construction? How do you get rid of rust on monosteel blade? Does the same rust removal techniques for laminated blades apply? Polishing and etching? Would you apply vinegar or other etching acids(citric acids or Fecl) to a rusty monosteel blade? Thanks! Oldschldude

Blade dark spot early rust.
Slightly surface rust.
Pitted rust spots.
Crusty rust whole blade.

In my very humble opinion is it required to clean a rusted blade, equal which material is used or you think is hidden and equal from where the blade coming. There are exceptions for example when a blade shows a nice patination, see for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=tabak
Not every blade need to be polished and etched but it should be cleaned from active rust. By cleaning you will learn also about the blade material and forging. See for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=apalit
The bolo I've shown overthere I get with a complete rusted blade which is cleaned now but not etched. One day I will etch it maybe but until now I am not sure which steel is used nor I am able to tell if the blade is laminated.

Hope it will help a little bit.

Regards,
Detlef

[oldschldude]

Hello Everyone,
Thanks estcrh, Timo Nieminen, blue lander for your replies and thanks Detlef for the pics and link you had provided. I've been trying to attach pics but having problems uploading...I will try again later. Thanks! Oldschldude

[oldschldude]

Hello.
I'm back with pics. Finally figured out how to compress photos using MS Paint.

Most info that I read about rust removal or blade restoration was on laminated Philippine blades. Didn't know if etching also applies to mono steal.
I'm attaching my barong pics that I would like to clean the blade. It started to get dark spots and small pits. I would hate to ruin it by improperly cleaning the blade. I would like to get rid of the dark spots and don't know if etching it would ruin the blade or change to different color. I will use warm vinegar if I will etch it.
I never etched a blade before, I only apply oil to preserve it. Most of my info in blade restoration I got here and I think this barong is mono steel. One question is, When did the filipinos start using leafsprings? WW2 era or before that like in Span-Am War. Thanks again everyone. Oldschldude

[oldschldude]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Agree, when you don't have polished and etched the blade you can't know if the blade is monosteel. So my first post where I've asked for pictures.
I have some Luzon blades which seems to be worked from rasps. You never will be able to tell which steel is used until you have cleaned and etched the blade.
See for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=luzon

Regards,
Detlef

Hello Detlef and thanks for replying,
If I have this stage of rust on my mono steel blade, can i put a sword with this stage of rust in a plastic pipe filled with pineapple juice after i polish the blade or will warm vinegar will do its work maybe a couple of passes/cycle of vinegar etching. By the way, you did an excellent job on this blade. Thanks again. Oldschhldude

[oldschldude]

Originally Posted by Sajen

In my very humble opinion is it required to clean a rusted blade, equal which material is used or you think is hidden and equal from where the blade coming. There are exceptions for example when a blade shows a nice patination, see for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=tabak
Not every blade need to be polished and etched but it should be cleaned from active rust. By cleaning you will learn also about the blade material and forging. See for example here: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ghlight=apalit
The bolo I've shown overthere I get with a complete rusted blade which is cleaned now but not etched. One day I will etch it maybe but until now I am not sure which steel is used nor I am able to tell if the blade is laminated.

Hope it will help a little bit.

Regards,
Detlef

Hello,
On your reply above, "Not every blade need to be polished and etched but it should be cleaned from active rust." How do you do that? Get rid of active rust... Thanks Oldschldude

[Sajen]

Hello Oldschldude,

the blade from the Luzon sword in up I've cleaned with sandpaper only, by such a rusted blade you can start with 80 and can end with 1000 to get a nice smooth finish but know people which go higher.
Your barong blade don't seems to have bad rust so I would start with 120 or 160 paper. I bet that your blade will show lamination, look close to the spine if you can see lamination lines.
I wouldn't clean such a blade with any sort of acid like pineapple juice, the blade will get a grey/dull surface and it will need a lot of polishing to get it away again. The sandpaper you can use dry or with oil. Before you start to etch a blade clean it with aceton to remove all oil and grease.
Thank you for the compliment.

Best regards,
Detlef

[oldschldude]

Originally Posted by Sajen

Hello Oldschldude,

the blade from the Luzon sword in up I've cleaned with sandpaper only, by such a rusted blade you can start with 80 and can end with 1000 to get a nice smooth finish but know people which go higher.
Your barong blade don't seems to have bad rust so I would start with 120 or 160 paper. I bet that your blade will show lamination, look close to the spine if you can see lamination lines.
I wouldn't clean such a blade with any sort of acid like pineapple juice, the blade will get a grey/dull surface and it will need a lot of polishing to get it away again. The sandpaper you can use dry or with oil. Before you start to etch a blade clean it with aceton to remove all oil and grease.
Thank you for the compliment.

Best regards,
Detlef

Thank You for this information. I think I got a grip now on how to restore or preserve Filipino blades mono steel or laminated. The same process for both.
Either to etch or not to etch after polishing and the kinds of acid/techniques to use and their effects for etching. Also to restore or just to stop the rust or just leave it alone(oil) if blade has provenance of importance as someone on this forum mentioned. I will post pics before and after of this barong.

As for the history of materials used for construction,
I found this site just now. SANDATA — THE EDGED WEAPONS OF THE PHILIPPINES
http://www.arscives.com/historysteel...troduction.htm
Thanks again Detlef and everyone... Oldschldude

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by oldschldude

I will post pics before and after of this barong.

Curious to see the result!