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#1 |
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I would like to solicit comments about this knife. It was sold as 19thc Indo-Persian. I'm not sure what to make of it. I can't rule out that it is 20thc tourist. Please let me know what you think. TIA!
Harry |
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#2 |
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IMHO it is tourist
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#3 | |
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I wonder if it is not a fake? Thanks again for the help. Much appreciated. Harry |
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#4 |
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The stamped maker's mark on the blade makes me doubt that is a tourist thing, or a "fake" (by the way, can you define "fake?").
![]() Moreover, I doubt that is Indo-Persian . Judging by the shape and workmanship, I am more inclined to say it is Syria or Turkey. ![]() But I am definitely far from being a specialist so take my opinion more like a guess. |
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#5 | |
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#6 | |
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As Marius says, the stamp on the blade COULD suggest non tourist but then there are many "cartouches" and false stamps on blades of items which ARE tourist. The "engraving" on the other side of the blade looks a bit rough compared with the stamp. Your comment re "significant wear" is correct, but often the castings are of poor quality and created in the first place to look old and worn.....but what about the leather?? on the scabbard which looks very new from the pics. Finally just because one has not seen another piece like it does not mean that it is original. I also would be interested as to what you define as "FAKE" as opposed to "tourist". To me the term is used to describe an item which is made as a copy of an original so that large amounts of money can be made by selling it as an original. I do not see something like this with relatively low return being made as a fake. I reserve my original decision. Stu |
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#7 |
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Hi Harry,
I agree with all the things said above, the blade, Tourist and not fake... I think you should give us more pictures of the blade and inscriptions. Best, Kubur |
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#8 | |
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#9 |
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Brass fittings are deliberately worn down to appear old, but it's done too evenly.
Blade is far too new, with no real signs of age equivalent to the rest of the package. I can't speak to origin, but it appears to me as a deliberate attempt to mislead. |
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#10 |
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Possibly. It might be one of the many Indian languages and not Arabic at all, or a combination of the two. I will post some better photos later today.
I consider an item a fake when it pretends to be something it is not (fake Rolex, newly manufactured "antique", etc.). And I agree that price can be a factor in determining if an item is a fake or real. However, I would excersise caution there. Enough people counterfeit $20 bills these days that many cashiers examine them before accepting them. |
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#11 |
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Hopefully these are better. Here is how the seller described it:
"5 3/8 curved d.e. blade. The front with large chiseled panel incorporating numerous Arabic or Hindi characters, likely identifying the owner and date. Reverse with crisp maker's mark. One piece horn hilt with white metal mounts. Black leather covered scabbard with matching WM mounts". If it is a tourist item wouldn't you expect to see others similar to this occasionally? They would not make just one, right? |
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#12 |
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Yes that's not Arabic but obviously who ever wrote it tried to make it seem Arabic. I also think this piece is a tourist piece.
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#13 |
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I hate to say it, but just by looking at the overall fit and finish of this piece I must also agree that it is a tourist piece. JMHO
Best, Robert |
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#14 |
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Thanks everyone. Comments appreciated.
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#15 |
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I am uncertain if I am allowed to say this or not, but will try. The moderators can remove it if is not allowed.
I purchased this item and the "beater sword" in Michigan. Both were sold as 19thc. Last edited by Robert; 12th April 2016 at 04:36 PM. |
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#16 | |
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Collecting is something which establishes knowledge over time, but as has been said before it can be fatal to rush into a purchase without doing your homework first. Stu |
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#17 |
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If I might be permitted to add to Kahnjar1's reply, I've found it very useful, as a relative amateur in the field, to spend a lot of time looking at commercial sites which are well known for the quality of their items, and the accuracy of their descriptions. Of course the images on this site are also of great value, though I'm late in arriving here.
While it is impossible to see many of these objects in hand, I've been able to refine my perceptions by front-loading my visual memory with images of the Real Thing. It's surprising in a way to see how that has paid off when perusing sites like the giant internet auction bazaar: fakes and such seem to spring out as I view them. |
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#18 |
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I would also add to these 2 great ideas these:
BOOKS: many have been mentioned on this forum and are used as reference by experts, and us. MUSEUMS: whether in person or on the web, check these out as well for good quality examples. Final note on the inscriptions: They look like there are acid etched - a sign of lower quality and easy to do for tourists. |
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#19 | |
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The result of course is usually disaster in some form or other. Stu |
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#20 | |
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Well said, tested and proofed on own skin... or better said on own wallet! Luckily you are wrong on one it is not "fatal" to rush into a purchase without doing your homework, but only costly. ![]() PS: I try to stick to reputable dealers and auction houses but I very often find also them to be wrong when describing and item. |
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