Bugis Keris?

[blue lander]

At least that's what I think it is... the auction picture is rather dark. The hilt doesn't look exactly like other Bugis kerises. Is that what it is? I'll take better pictures when it arrives.

[David]

Well, i've never seen anything quite like that hilt. The sheath is Palembang, Sumatra and the blade does not look particularly Bugis to me from those photographs. I look forward to your own photos for a better examination.

[Rick]

That hilt form rings a bell with me; I seem to recall seeing a variation somewhere before, but I can't place it; were I to guess I would guess Sumatra .

[Sajen]

A very unusual Palembang keris. Is the scabbard lacquered?

[blue lander]

The auction doesn't mention if it's laquered but it does look like it. Here's a closeup of the scabbard.

I find it odd that the tip of the blade is so dull too. I wonder if it was made that way or if the original tip snapped off or something.

Dimensions from auction description:

Blade: 15 1/4"
OAL: 19 1/16"
OAL In sheath: 20 3/4"

[David]

Originally Posted by blue lander

I find it odd that the tip of the blade is so dull too. I wonder if it was made that way or if the original tip snapped off or something.

The keris is intended to be a stabbing weapon. My guess would be that the tip was reshaped after damage or erosion.

[Bjorn]

The hilt to me looks like a very abstract and stylized representation of a hilt form that is often attributed to the Lampung area of Sumatra.

As for Bugis influences, I can't see any of those in any part of this keris. The dress, as far as I know, could be from the Lampung area as well as Palembang.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by yuuzan

The hilt to me looks like a very abstract and stylized representation of a hilt form that is often attributed to the Lampung area of Sumatra.

As for Bugis influences, I can't see any of those in any part of this keris. The dress, as far as I know, could be from the Lampung area as well as Palembang.

I agree with you by the first statement. The pendokok is Bugis. The scabbard is like you said correct for both areas.
I've seen this keris by ebay but the strange hilt and the obviously painted scabbard and hilt let me stay away from this keris.

Regards,
Detlef

[Bjorn]

Originally Posted by Sajen

I agree with you by the first statement. The pendokok is Bugis. The scabbard is like you said correct for both areas.
I've seen this keris by ebay but the strange hilt and the obviously painted scabbard and hilt let me stay away from this keris.

Regards,
Detlef

Thank you for the addition, Detlef. I wrote in haste and am not very familiar with the different styles of pendokok.

[blue lander]

I wonder why they painted/lacquered it...

Does the blade itself look okay?

[Rick]

There is an old saying among Housepainters: putty and paint make it is what it ain't .
Then again, there could be nice wood underneath all that; maybe strong light will tell you when you receive it .

I wonder about the meaning (or not) of the two dimples that were put in the sorsoran .

I think the blade is genuinely old .

[A. G. Maisey]

Blade tip form is legitimate Javanese:- ngahbah kopong --- "empty rice field".

Blade itself could well be North Coast Jawa

[blue lander]

Interesting! The shape of the tip does look rather deliberate rather than just a snapped off point.

Is it likely the blade has any pamor? I I've read the guides about soaking it in coconut water and whatnot, but I have a feeling this would need a complete restaining...

[A. G. Maisey]

We can probably say that this keris has pamor sanak, that is, very low contrast or no contrast pamor of iron only. I doubt that a clean and restain would be of much benefit.

[blue lander]

This just arrived in the mail, will take photos later. It smells heavily of citrus so I guess somebody was trying to keep it happy.

The sheath is definitely painted. There's a lot of paint on the blade itself around the ganja. So I think it was definitely painted at a later date.

[blue lander]

The patina on the blade is really thick and caked on. So I wiped the blade down with a lime slice and started rubbing it with a paper towel. Just from the lime and paper towel most of the patina came off. I'm trying to remove the paint of the ganja area with acetone.

The question is, what should I do about the hilt and scabbard? Wipe the paint off?

The blade has a ovoid cross section. It's pretty thick from hilt to tip. I know kerises are stabbing weapons, but this one really feels like a slasher. What with the blunt tip, the thick slightly curved blade, and the "hooked" hilt. It's more like a mini kris.

[blue lander]

Acetone isn't doing much to remove the paint from the blade. Any suggestions?

[blue lander]

I've had good success stripping the scabbard with rubbing alcohol. The wood's actually pretty nice! I still have a ways to go obviously. One side is more banged up than the other, which I guess is typical of a scabbard that's been worn for awhole.

[David]

Well, it looks like this sheath had a fairly major patch job done at one time which is probably what the paint was attempting to cover up. I wouldn't exactly refer to this a "typical" wear.
I would now try using finer and finer sandpaper in stages to smooth the wood out and remove all remnants of paint and former state and then re-stain it to a good color. You may then want to put a finish on it. I like a product called Birchwood Casey Tru Oil which is generally used for finishing gun stocks, but there are many other choices as well.
You probably want to give the hilt the same treatment.

[blue lander]

Is that oval inlay a repair? I assumed it was a decoration. It follows the contour of the scabbard.

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by blue lander

Is that oval inlay a repair? I assumed it was a decoration. It follows the contour of the scabbard.

Yes, clearly a repair. Maybe wood worms have done at this place their job. And this was the reason why the scabbard get a coat of lacquer. I would follow the advice from David.

Regards,
Detlef

[blue lander]

Jeesh, somebody really went to great lengths to keep this scabbard going.. I wonder if these repairs were made in Java or the west.

Okay, I'll lightly sand it down, stain it, and oil it.

[A. G. Maisey]

That large inlay of wood is not the sort of repair I have ever seen in Jawa or Bali. If it had been found necessary to do such an inlay there, the inlay would have been done in a contrasting material, say a very different wood, such as black ebony, or possibly mother of pearl --- I have a Balinese scabbard with MOP inlay in the gandar, which I am inclined to believe was done to conceal damage. Any inlay should be done so there is no visible gap between inlay and the base material:- it MUST be neat.

If you find other small areas of damage during restoration worm holes --- little dents, it is normal practice to fill these holes with a contrasting material and to try to make that contrast look like a natural feature. Good fill is button shellac, or a plastic putty tinted with burnt umber powder.

Before going ahead with application of the finish --- Birchwood Casey as David suggests, or if you cannot find this, ordinary Scandinavian oil does a good job --- you should steam the wood to raise the whisker and then polish the whisker off with 0000 steel wool, dust down, then apply the finish. You might have to raise the whisker a few times before it stops raising.

The finish should be applied with a rubber. A rubber is old, lint free cloth, like say, an old handkerchief, you make a little ball, about 1 inch diameter, of cotton wool, wrap this in the hanky so you have a round absorbent pad, then you apply the finish in a figure of eight pattern. With either Birchwood Casey, or Scandinavian Oil count on applying a minimum of 6 to 8 very thin coats before the job is complete. You should very lightly sand between coats with 00 steel wool, and dust off before applying the next coat. This approach means it will take you ten minutes a day for a week or more to complete the application of the finish.

If it is too glossy when complete you can cut the gloss a bit with a very light rub with 0000 steel wool.

The joint between the top of the scabbard and the down piece of the scabbard (gandar) is often damaged in an old scabbard, in Jawa and Bali this is mostly hidden with either a pendok, or just a small band of silver or some other metal.

[blue lander]

I don't see any worm holes anywhere else on the hilt or scabbard. Just some bumps and dings. The repair definitely doesn't fit the hole perfectly, you can see some wood filler around the edges. But they did match the contours of the scabbard pretty well, so somebody did put some effort into it.

Thanks for the steps on how to refinish the scabbard. Any advice on how to remove the paint from the blade itself? Alcohol and acetone aren't doing the trick. I'm going to try soaking it in hot soapy water next.

Edit: Hot soapy water is working ok, slowly but surely removing the paint
the steel of the blade is turning an odd shade of light green, though.

[A. G. Maisey]

There are various types of paint, and various ways to remove them, if you can identify the paint type, you simply use the appropriate paint remover.

However, if I was going to remove the paint, I'd use heat to blister it, then scrub off with a hard brush and mineral turps. After that I'd go over the blade carefully using magnification and a sharp pick, something like a saddlers awl, and make sure there was no paint left in the cracks. Then probably several soaks and rinses in mineral turps and a drench with WD40.

If you intend to go straight to a stain, you could use a vinegar soak after the paint was off, and omit the WD40.