kaskara for komment...and translation

[stephen wood]

An interesting example - engraving to both sides of the blade, a nice scabbard with a double strap, good condition overall....
Quite similar to this one and this one.
The silver-hilted one in Christopher Spring "African Arms and Armour" appears quite similar too.

[colin henshaw]

Looks a fine sword, Stephen. Presumably it has received a new scabbard and leather hilt fairly recently.

Would be interesting to have a translation of the Arabic script.

Regards.

[stephen wood]

Yes, all the leatherwork is relatively new and supple. The joins on the scabbard are glued - older scabbards tend to be stitched. I wonder about the significance of the "leaves" and the long cords on the strap. Similar, longer attachments are found on Manding scabbards I think...The inscriptions is said to be a well-known Koranic verse which translated approximately says "...if God is on our side nothing can harm us".

[Dom]

Originally Posted by stephen wood

The inscriptions is said to be a well-known Koranic verse which translated approximately says "...if God is on our side nothing can harm us".

Hi Stephen
a little more precisly
the 1st lign is part (first sentence) of the verse 58 surate "Al Furqan"
" .... WA TAKALTO ALA EL LAZI LAYAMOUT CHA'HET AL WOUGOUD" either in English; "AND TRUST THOU IN THE LIVEING ONE WHO DIETH NO".

the 2nd sentence; certainly extracted from the Holy quran, but I didn't find exactly the surate
" WA OMAT AL APTSAR WA TAWAKALTO ALA ALLAH EL WAHED QL KA'HARE" either in English; "WITNESS FOR OUR TIME BEING, THEIR VIEW IS BLIND, GOD IS UNIQUE AND ALWAYS VICTORIOUS".

à +

Dom

[stephen wood]

wow many thanks Dom...

[Jim McDougall]

Nice work Dom! Thank you for always being so helpful with these inscriptions, it really adds so much to appreciating these swords.

Is there some explanation for the crescent symbolism as seen here in multiple sequences? Something key to the Sudan ? It seems we have seen this motif on some other kaskaras.

[Dom]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

Is there some explanation for the crescent symbolism

only informations I might bring is
- the crescent is not (repeat, NOT) official symbol of Islam.
- appear, just with Ottomans when they took over Istanbul, the crescent was the town's symbol, they decided to use it as their own.

but no direct linkage with the Islamic religion,more,
some Muslims consider the use of any symbol,
and especially the crescent moon which was originally pagan, to be a sin.

à +

Dom

[Jim McDougall]

Thanks Dom.
I was aware that the crescent symbolism long predated Islam, and that the use of symbols and images varys within the various sects and followings of the Faith.

It seems that the folk religions of certain regions, in this case the Sudan, follow Islam in varying application accordingly and sometimes nominally, and that celestial symbolism has some specific importance there. It seems the crescent had some such symbolism in ancient Egyptian pantheons.

[Dom]

Originally Posted by Jim McDougall

It seems that the folk religions of certain regions, in this case the Sudan, follow Islam in varying application accordingly and sometimes nominally, and that celestial symbolism has some specific importance there. It seems the crescent had some such symbolism in ancient Egyptian pantheons.

Hi Jim
That is not taking enough in consideration that Islam came to these regions after Christianity, which had already and severely erase the ancient beliefs.
The Egyptian pharaoh beliefs was completely vanish from the spirit when Muslims over load the Sudan, more than 1000 years later

From the third century to the sixth century the whole of Sudan was Christian, and was even the official religion. Then the seventh century to the fifteenth century the two religions live in coexistence almost peaceful.

I am skeptical about some reminicent of a religion for over 1000 years,
especially when you know the damage that Christians have inflicted on the Pharaonic monuments
later Muslims continued destruction of the work already undertaken

might be possible (under reserve) to find some signs of "Kaballah" mix-up with some other Islamic objects for magical practices, but never saw or noticed pharaonic marks or signs

but ... I never forget my favorite thought;
in those countries, every thing is possible, and more specially the impossible
it's land of wonders, or it's not ??

à +

Dom

[Jim McDougall]

Excellent synopsis of the religious history of Sudanic regions Dom! Thank you for explaining it so well. It still leaves me curious about what this crescentic motif might signify, or do you suppose it might just be stylized use of the familiar dual crescents seen on blades of takoubas and trade blades used on kaskaras?



All the best,
Jim

[Jim McDougall]

As noted, Dom always is extremely helpful with these inscriptions, and in my curiosity about these celestial symbolisms and motif, what I have found seems to agree with his point about them being perceived as perhaps talismanic as seen by natives on European blades. These trade blades were typically regarded as powerful and in native perception perhaps these symbols, often derived from Kabbalistic examples, were seen as imbuing that power.

As Stephen has noted in his original post, there are other examples of this type motif seen in kaskara blades, one belonging to Charles S. and the other from Oriental Arms, both with groupings of what appear to be crescents in similar arrangements to this example. Apparantly these seem to be used in conjunction with or in similar arrangement to representations of the 'Lohr', a panel of wood with religious inscriptions and invocations, on these blades.
It seems in some cases, astronomical events such as the old moon in the new moon are represented.

In "European Blades in Tuareg Swords and Daggers" (Dr. L.Cabot Briggs, JAAS, Vol. V, #2, 1965) the blades describes are also certain kaskara blades.In Plate XV (p.56) there is a blade which has extant European decorative designs, and at the forte, there are linear half circles on opposing sides of the blade face, with a circle between, reminiscent of these patterns with more fully inscribed images.
The author notes this motif of semi circles and circles appear to be Sudanese work and probably applied after the blade arrived in Africa.

On the blade seen in the Oriental Arms example shown (linked by Stephen in orig post) at the base of the motif, which seems almost floral rather than crescents, one can see the familiar opposed man in the moon faces typically seen on takouba blades.

Dr. Briggs (op.cit.p.89) notes "...the occurrence on some swords of the 'Hausa' type of half moon marks stamped over elaborate Arabic inscriptions inlaid in silver suggests also that such marks may have been applied sometimes in the Sudan to imported blades".

It would seem that the Sudanese, and perhaps the Taureg, in thier use of crescents or man in the moon stamps, often in opposed arrangement in motif, must have perceived some talismanic property to them as mentioned here.

It would seem that in most cases, these geometrically stylized images would have been within the perameters of acceptibility in most cases as decorative motif along with religious invocations such as the representations of the Lohr.
Admittedly speculation on my part, and of course looking forward to other views.

In many parts of the Sahara, particularly Tunisia, symbols such as the fish, crescent, star and birds are good luck symbols and often are used in material culture such as textiles etc.

Best regards,
Jim

[Dom]

Originally Posted by Dom

wrong message,
mix photos, and then pic and translation are not for the "kaskara", sorry Stephen

Hi Stephen
a little more precisly
the 1st lign is part (first sentence) of the verse 58 surate "Al Furqan"
" .... WA TAKALTO ALA EL LAZI LAYAMOUT CHA'HET AL WOUGOUD" either in English; "AND TRUST THOU IN THE LIVEING ONE WHO DIETH NO".

the 2nd sentence; certainly extracted from the Holy quran, but I didn't find exactly the surate
" WA OMAT AL APTSAR WA TAWAKALTO ALA ALLAH EL WAHED QL KA'HARE" either in English; "WITNESS FOR OUR TIME BEING, THEIR VIEW IS BLIND, GOD IS UNIQUE AND ALWAYS VICTORIOUS".

Originally Posted by Dom

à +

Dom

[Dom]

Hi Stephen ... now your right translation
I'm realy confuse, and deeply sorry for that mess

- BISMILLAH IN YANSURKOM ALLAH FALLA RALEB (lakum) either in English IN THE NAME OF GOD WHO IS GIVING THE VICTORY WHO IS (INVINCIBLE)

- LAKUM ALLAHOU AKBAR WA ILLAH AL KHAMD ALLAHOU AKBAR either in English (invincible) GOD IS THE MOST GREAT WHO IS UNIQUE ALL THANKS FOR HIM GOD IS THE MOST GREAT

à +

Dom

[stephen wood]

...no need to apologise Dom

Many thanks again for your help.

[Jim McDougall]

Originally Posted by stephen wood

...no need to apologise Dom

Many thanks again for your help.

Yes, thank you Dom, for answering my post.
Stephen, thank you for posting, I thought we lost ya.

[stephen wood]

...actually, I thinks it's one of the nicest I've handled - it has pretty much everything you would want to see on a kaskara. The leatherwork is particularly well done and it does have the mysterious second strap...