keris java

semar · 8th July 2015, 10:42 AM

ho can help me with this kind of dapur

regards semar

kronckew · 8th July 2015, 12:06 PM

nice wiggly blade.

Jean · 8th July 2015, 05:06 PM

Hello Semar,
From the pics and although they are small it seems to me that the sogokan was carved more recently than the blade itself (black color and uneven shape). What do you think?
Regards

semar · 9th July 2015, 07:05 PM

when i know something about this blad but one thing i dont belive that the sogokan is carved recentley but thats what i think because the uneven shape

regards semar

Jean · 10th July 2015, 03:45 PM

Nobody interested in this subject?
Semar, what strikes me in the sogokans of your blade is that they are straight and don't look harmonious, rather than following the curve of the first luk, see a similar blade with 11 luk and 2 other detailed pics showing what I mean. I cannot identify the dapur as I don't know if the sogokans are original or not.
Regards

David · 10th July 2015, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Semar, what strikes me in the sogokans of your blade is that they are straight and don't look harmonious, rather than following the curve of the first luk, see a similar blade with 11 luk and 2 other detailed pics showing what I mean.

Well, the images aren't really large enough for be to come to any real conclusion on your theory on this blade Jean. The lack of harmonious flow is not unusual in keris, only a sign of a less adept blade smith. I have seen countless numbers of keris with sogokan that fall far short of ideal perfection for that form, but that doesn't necessarily mean the sogokan were carved at a later date, just that they weren't carved well at the time. The examples you are posting are just better keris.

A. G. Maisey · 10th July 2015, 11:10 PM

Jean, the vast bulk of all keris made since, say, the 1600's, are very ordinary keris.

Why?

Because ordinary people cannot afford to pay for the services of competent artists.

Most keris in existence do not come within a bull's roar of observing the parameters that make even a halfway decent keris.

Semar's keris is original and worn. Look at the kruwingan.

What would this keris have had to look like before sogokan were cut to have kruwingan like this?

Further, why would anybody want to cut sogokan into an old, very ordinary blade?

Semar, it might be possible to match this blade to something listed in a pakem, but it is far more likely that it does not follow any set down dhapur, the reasons being the same that I have mentioned above.

In respect of tangguh, many half-educated people would give this blade as either Pengging or Pajang, it is neither.

Jean · 11th July 2015, 10:47 AM

Thank you David and Alan

semar · 17th July 2015, 12:14 PM

Thank you guys for your commend
i hoop for penggi because the looks

semar

8th July 2015, 10:42 AM	#1
semar Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 272	keris java ho can help me with this kind of dapur regards semar Attached Images

8th July 2015, 12:06 PM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,259	nice wiggly blade. Wiggle Last edited by kronckew; 8th July 2015 at 12:29 PM.

10th July 2015, 03:45 PM	#5
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Nobody interested in this subject? Semar, what strikes me in the sogokans of your blade is that they are straight and don't look harmonious, rather than following the curve of the first luk, see a similar blade with 11 luk and 2 other detailed pics showing what I mean. I cannot identify the dapur as I don't know if the sogokans are original or not. Regards Attached Images

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8th July 2015, 05:06 PM	#3
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Hello Semar, From the pics and although they are small it seems to me that the sogokan was carved more recently than the blade itself (black color and uneven shape). What do you think? Regards

9th July 2015, 07:05 PM	#4
semar Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 272	when i know something about this blad but one thing i dont belive that the sogokan is carved recentley but thats what i think because the uneven shape regards semar

10th July 2015, 11:10 PM	#7
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 7,085	Jean, the vast bulk of all keris made since, say, the 1600's, are very ordinary keris. Why? Because ordinary people cannot afford to pay for the services of competent artists. Most keris in existence do not come within a bull's roar of observing the parameters that make even a halfway decent keris. Semar's keris is original and worn. Look at the kruwingan. What would this keris have had to look like before sogokan were cut to have kruwingan like this? Further, why would anybody want to cut sogokan into an old, very ordinary blade? Semar, it might be possible to match this blade to something listed in a pakem, but it is far more likely that it does not follow any set down dhapur, the reasons being the same that I have mentioned above. In respect of tangguh, many half-educated people would give this blade as either Pengging or Pajang, it is neither.

11th July 2015, 10:47 AM	#8
Jean Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 1,740	Thank you David and Alan

17th July 2015, 12:14 PM	#9
semar Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 272	Thank you guys for your commend i hoop for penggi because the looks semar