Poto at last.

Tim Simmons · 11th January 2009, 05:13 PM

Nice old one with beautiful engraved blade which I cannot show as the light has gone. Lost some old friends to get this rather delicate chum.

Tim Simmons · 12th January 2009, 12:16 PM

A few details. Note the zinc? repair. This raises questions about sub-saharan brass production.

katana · 12th January 2009, 03:28 PM

Hi Tim,
I also like the blade shape on these swords. The pommels always seem to be covered in leather, cloth or fur ......do they just 'cover' a wooden pommel or is there something (talismatic, 'magical' ) contained below the 'covering' material.
Would it be worth 'injecting' small amounts of resin/aradite into the cracks to provide 'stability' so that the repair could be removed from the area....or are you leaving it 'as is'.

Kind Regards David

Tim Simmons · 12th January 2009, 05:41 PM

David, it is a rather mysterious bundle of "magic" or "medicine" or "talismans" all tied up in a cotton cloth and very fine skin leather. Then tied around the handle. Now after a century or more all too delicate I am afraid. I would love to know what sort of stuff is in the bundle. It sounds very silly but could well be something as simple as "magic dust". Perhaps one of our esteemed Belgian members has come across enough of these to be lucky and afford to take one apart?

VANDOO · 12th January 2009, 05:54 PM

THE POMMEL COVER IS A FETISH BAG I SUPPOSE THESE ARE MADE AND PUT ON THE SWORD BY THE WITCHDOCTOR UNLESS THE SWORDMAKERS ARE WITCHDOCTORS AND CAN MAKE THE SWORD AND THE FETISH. THEY ARE OFTEN COVERED IN LEOPARD FUR BUT I HAVE SEEN OTHER FUR USED BUT SUSPECT LEOPARD IS THE PREFERRED MATERIAL. I HAVE ALSO SEEN QUITE A FEW WITH THE FETISH BAG MISSING AND HAVE HEARD STORIES THAT MISSONAIRYS HAD THEM REMOVE THEM AS IT WAS CONSIDERED A HEATHEN SUPERSTITION TO BELIEVE IN MAGIC AND WITCHDOCTORS.
I HAVE NO IDEA AS TO WHAT GOES INTO A FETISH BAG BUT YOU SEE THEM ON AFRICAN, NIAS, DAYAK WEAPONS AND IN MANY INSTANCES CHARMS AND TAILSMEN ARE WRITTEN ON THE SWORDS OR PERHAPS A SMALL PIECE OF PAPER WITH A STRONG CHARM IS INSERTED SOMEWHERE. THE AMERICAN TRIBES OFTEN CARRIED A MEDICINE BAG WHICH WAS ALSO A FETISH.
IT WOULD BE INTERESTING IF A STUDY HAS BEEN DONE ON THE CONTENTS OF THE FETISHES AND THE POWERS ASSOCIATED WITH THOSE CONTENTS.
CONGRADULATIONS ON A NICE OLD SWORD.

katana · 12th January 2009, 06:31 PM

Apparently this form of sword is attributable to several tribes Ngombe, Poto or Ngbandi.

Found this example, which has lost the pommel covering....to reveal straw. However, this could have been 'protection' for an object held within or even the straw itself may have symbolic or religious meaning. It is 'so easy' ...with western eyes to think the 'straw' is insignificant or just 'stuffing'. Afterall it could be dried grass that originally grew on sacred ground etc.It is known through the centuries that some warriors carried a small quantity of 'home soil' as a talisman ....even dracula in Stoker's story needed earth from his native country , sprinkled in his coffin. Perhaps, a similar idea

http://www.hamillgallery.com/CURRENC...CY/Poto04.html

http://www.hamillgallery.com/CURRENC...CY/Poto11.html

Regards David

11th January 2009, 05:13 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Poto at last. Nice old one with beautiful engraved blade which I cannot show as the light has gone. Lost some old friends to get this rather delicate chum. Attached Images

12th January 2009, 12:16 PM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	A few details. Note the zinc? repair. This raises questions about sub-saharan brass production. Attached Images

12th January 2009, 05:54 PM	#5
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THE POMMEL COVER IS A FETISH BAG I SUPPOSE THESE ARE MADE AND PUT ON THE SWORD BY THE WITCHDOCTOR UNLESS THE SWORDMAKERS ARE WITCHDOCTORS AND CAN MAKE THE SWORD AND THE FETISH. THEY ARE OFTEN COVERED IN LEOPARD FUR BUT I HAVE SEEN OTHER FUR USED BUT SUSPECT LEOPARD IS THE PREFERRED MATERIAL. I HAVE ALSO SEEN QUITE A FEW WITH THE FETISH BAG MISSING AND HAVE HEARD STORIES THAT MISSONAIRYS HAD THEM REMOVE THEM AS IT WAS CONSIDERED A HEATHEN SUPERSTITION TO BELIEVE IN MAGIC AND WITCHDOCTORS. I HAVE NO IDEA AS TO WHAT GOES INTO A FETISH BAG BUT YOU SEE THEM ON AFRICAN, NIAS, DAYAK WEAPONS AND IN MANY INSTANCES CHARMS AND TAILSMEN ARE WRITTEN ON THE SWORDS OR PERHAPS A SMALL PIECE OF PAPER WITH A STRONG CHARM IS INSERTED SOMEWHERE. THE AMERICAN TRIBES OFTEN CARRIED A MEDICINE BAG WHICH WAS ALSO A FETISH. IT WOULD BE INTERESTING IF A STUDY HAS BEEN DONE ON THE CONTENTS OF THE FETISHES AND THE POWERS ASSOCIATED WITH THOSE CONTENTS. CONGRADULATIONS ON A NICE OLD SWORD. Last edited by VANDOO; 12th January 2009 at 06:26 PM.

12th January 2009, 03:28 PM	#3
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Hi Tim, I also like the blade shape on these swords. The pommels always seem to be covered in leather, cloth or fur ......do they just 'cover' a wooden pommel or is there something (talismatic, 'magical' ) contained below the 'covering' material. Would it be worth 'injecting' small amounts of resin/aradite into the cracks to provide 'stability' so that the repair could be removed from the area....or are you leaving it 'as is'. Kind Regards David

12th January 2009, 05:41 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	David, it is a rather mysterious bundle of "magic" or "medicine" or "talismans" all tied up in a cotton cloth and very fine skin leather. Then tied around the handle. Now after a century or more all too delicate I am afraid. I would love to know what sort of stuff is in the bundle. It sounds very silly but could well be something as simple as "magic dust". Perhaps one of our esteemed Belgian members has come across enough of these to be lucky and afford to take one apart?

12th January 2009, 06:31 PM	#6
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Apparently this form of sword is attributable to several tribes Ngombe, Poto or Ngbandi. Found this example, which has lost the pommel covering....to reveal straw. However, this could have been 'protection' for an object held within or even the straw itself may have symbolic or religious meaning. It is 'so easy' ...with western eyes to think the 'straw' is insignificant or just 'stuffing'. Afterall it could be dried grass that originally grew on sacred ground etc.It is known through the centuries that some warriors carried a small quantity of 'home soil' as a talisman ....even dracula in Stoker's story needed earth from his native country , sprinkled in his coffin. Perhaps, a similar idea http://www.hamillgallery.com/CURRENC...CY/Poto04.html http://www.hamillgallery.com/CURRENC...CY/Poto11.html Regards David