Curious construction, fantasy

Tim Simmons · 10th December 2007, 07:55 PM

Looks like the agricultural sycthe blade may have seen some use. Cool bread or carving knife handle. All very creative with that copper disc.

cheap too

em hmm I need one

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA:IT&ih=002

Jim McDougall · 10th December 2007, 11:22 PM

Ahah!!! the true origins of the shotel!!! Ancient druids in Abyssinia !

fearn · 10th December 2007, 11:42 PM

Actually, there are thousands of druids worldwide, and there have been for centuries. The modern English druids started off as fraternal societies around the same time the Freemasons appeared, and for much the same reason. Some have stayed around as fraternal groups, even providing insurance, some have become pagan worshipers at Stonehenge, and some are both. Around 1900, the druids were largely in fraternal orders, and they used sickles as regalia. There's even a photo of Winston Churchill in one of those funny white robes.

So the bottom line is, yes, this is probably a genuine druid's sickle, and yes, it probably was cobbled together out of an old farmer's sickle and a carving knife handle, although it may have been purpose-built. While it perhaps isn't as classy as a freemason's sword or some such, it is likely a genuine piece of regalia from a fraternal order. For those who care about such things, I'd also speculate that those who made and used it were good, church-going Christians, too.

My 0.02 cents,

F

Jim McDougall · 11th December 2007, 12:04 AM

Thanks Fearn for the most interesting historical information on the Druids. My frivolous comment was meant only as that, and as a comparitive jest with thoughts of discussions on shotels recently. I hope I didnt offend anyone with Druid associations, and if so, I heartily apologize.

Actually the item is quite attractive, though admittedly thought the description misperceived. I guess I'm getting too used to the sometimes bizarre auction descriptions often posted here.

With your notes I decided to look more seriously at what you described and found that the sickle (though typically stated to be gold), was indeed used to harvest mistletoe and herbs in Druid ritual. It is apparantly termed a 'boline' and I did discover mention of the fraternal order you have described having organized in 1717 with many distinguished members.

Best regards,
Jim

fearn · 11th December 2007, 12:12 AM

Not a problem, Jim. We're all used to weirdness on eBay.

Every once in a while, it's genuine weirdness.

So far as I know, the term "boline" seems to show up more in Wicca and ritual magic than druidry. There everyone knows the story about the golden sickle (I think it was a "falx" in Pliny) and thinks of druids together with their sickles, as in the Druid Getafix in The Adventures of Asterix. It's reportedly possible to harvest mistletoe with a golden sickle (low carat gold), but I've never hard the money to try that particular experiment.

Given the mix of modern pagans and old fraternal orders, it's likely that we're going to see more and more of these ritual items showing up, along with the Keris and African knives that we normally put in this categoy. While I'm not an expert, I suspect that an older item with a decent provenance would be fairly valuable.

kronckew · 11th December 2007, 04:29 PM

had a couple of seax* made by a guy who also does bolines,
his 'golden sickles' are actually made of bronze, which i'd guess is more likely for the early pre-roman druids.
the blades are a bit smaller than the ebay one.

you can get them in the traditional rowan wood hafts.
bronze athames also

bronze does not poison the magic, the fey folke are poisoned by steel and iron.
pentagrams a common motif: (esmerelda dagger thread?)

steel, stainless, and pattern welded steel blades also available as well.

* my seax, just because i like them

10th December 2007, 07:55 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,774	Curious construction, fantasy Looks like the agricultural sycthe blade may have seen some use. Cool bread or carving knife handle. All very creative with that copper disc. cheap too em hmm I need one http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA:IT&ih=002

10th December 2007, 11:42 PM	#3
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Actually, there are thousands of druids worldwide, and there have been for centuries. The modern English druids started off as fraternal societies around the same time the Freemasons appeared, and for much the same reason. Some have stayed around as fraternal groups, even providing insurance, some have become pagan worshipers at Stonehenge, and some are both. Around 1900, the druids were largely in fraternal orders, and they used sickles as regalia. There's even a photo of Winston Churchill in one of those funny white robes. So the bottom line is, yes, this is probably a genuine druid's sickle, and yes, it probably was cobbled together out of an old farmer's sickle and a carving knife handle, although it may have been purpose-built. While it perhaps isn't as classy as a freemason's sword or some such, it is likely a genuine piece of regalia from a fraternal order. For those who care about such things, I'd also speculate that those who made and used it were good, church-going Christians, too. My 0.02 cents, F Last edited by fearn; 11th December 2007 at 12:05 AM.

10th December 2007, 11:22 PM	#2
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,887	Ahah!!! the true origins of the shotel!!! Ancient druids in Abyssinia !

11th December 2007, 12:04 AM	#4
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,887	Thanks Fearn for the most interesting historical information on the Druids. My frivolous comment was meant only as that, and as a comparitive jest with thoughts of discussions on shotels recently. I hope I didnt offend anyone with Druid associations, and if so, I heartily apologize. Actually the item is quite attractive, though admittedly thought the description misperceived. I guess I'm getting too used to the sometimes bizarre auction descriptions often posted here. With your notes I decided to look more seriously at what you described and found that the sickle (though typically stated to be gold), was indeed used to harvest mistletoe and herbs in Druid ritual. It is apparantly termed a 'boline' and I did discover mention of the fraternal order you have described having organized in 1717 with many distinguished members. Best regards, Jim

11th December 2007, 12:12 AM	#5
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Not a problem, Jim. We're all used to weirdness on eBay. Every once in a while, it's genuine weirdness. So far as I know, the term "boline" seems to show up more in Wicca and ritual magic than druidry. There everyone knows the story about the golden sickle (I think it was a "falx" in Pliny) and thinks of druids together with their sickles, as in the Druid Getafix in The Adventures of Asterix. It's reportedly possible to harvest mistletoe with a golden sickle (low carat gold), but I've never hard the money to try that particular experiment. Given the mix of modern pagans and old fraternal orders, it's likely that we're going to see more and more of these ritual items showing up, along with the Keris and African knives that we normally put in this categoy. While I'm not an expert, I suspect that an older item with a decent provenance would be fairly valuable.

11th December 2007, 04:29 PM	#6
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,167	had a couple of seax* made by a guy who also does bolines, his 'golden sickles' are actually made of bronze, which i'd guess is more likely for the early pre-roman druids. the blades are a bit smaller than the ebay one. you can get them in the traditional rowan wood hafts. bronze athames also bronze does not poison the magic, the fey folke are poisoned by steel and iron. pentagrams a common motif: (esmerelda dagger thread?) steel, stainless, and pattern welded steel blades also available as well. * my seax, just because i like them