A tale of two sticks

Tim Simmons · 24th August 2009, 10:31 AM

I will show better pictures of mine, the cheap one when it arrives.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Well three if you count this smaller one which I think is very nce. Just did not have the money for it.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

Tim Simmons · 25th August 2009, 05:58 PM

If this is not a pole club just like the other one sold on ebay, then I am not fully human

103cm long 647g. It is just like examples illustrated in "Ethnology of Vanuatu - An early twentieth century study - Feelix Speiser - Hawai University Press" I also show it the same ebay style.

graeme gt · 25th August 2009, 09:50 PM

Nice looking timber sort of rosewoody .

Tim Simmons · 25th August 2009, 10:24 PM

As far as I have found out there is an Eastern Australian and one would assume the same with Australasian Islands too, a Rosewood, but that is just a trade name as scientifically it is not a true rosewood. "fearn" might be able to help as he is a botanist.

fearn · 26th August 2009, 12:28 AM

Not touching the ID on this until I get a better idea where it came from. Rosewood is a messy term, and while I agree that it looks "rosewoody," but there are a lot of dark tropical timbers, and I'll need to dig to get a better answer. The smaller a geographical area I have to dig in, the better.

Are we saying Vanuatu for certain, or was that a guess?

F

Tim Simmons · 26th August 2009, 08:23 AM

Thanks fearn, pretty much what I expected. I cannot be certain it is from Vanuatu. It could be from many other Islands but it does fit with illustrations in the afore mentioned publication.

colin henshaw · 26th August 2009, 09:25 AM

Hi Tim

I'm fairly sure this is African Blackwood - it looks like an East African stick, probably Masai or nearby.

Regards

Tim Simmons · 26th August 2009, 01:06 PM

It does indeed Colin, but then again it does not?

Tim Simmons · 26th August 2009, 02:33 PM

These do not help either, Africa stuck between the Solomons and Fiji/Samoa.

Tim Simmons · 26th August 2009, 05:46 PM

Hoping not to bore everyone to tears I just want to add this.

The reason I am thinking this is a pole club is by the weight and that niether end has ever been in contact with the ground. This makes me feel it is a cared for weapon that may have taken considerable effort to make with limited access to steel tools? Pictures of the ends, also an interesting picure of Samburu sticks from "Cradle of Mankind - Mohamed Amin" these are to some degree more crude and do have contact with the ground.

fearn · 26th August 2009, 09:44 PM

Hi Tim,

Actually, that does help. Although we both know that there are a lot of blackwoods and rosewoods in the tropics, this is a good lesson in how hard it can be to attempt to trace a club based on the wood it is made from. It wood actually be easier to do it from the smell of the wood that the color, at least theoretically.

Stylistically, I think you've got a point, which is that this stick doesn't seem to have been a generic walking stick (due to lack of scarring from the ground), and I'm comfortable calling it a pole club.

Best,

F

24th August 2009, 10:31 AM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	A tale of two sticks I will show better pictures of mine, the cheap one when it arrives. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT Well three if you count this smaller one which I think is very nce. Just did not have the money for it. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...=STRK:MEWAX:IT

25th August 2009, 05:58 PM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	If this is not a pole club just like the other one sold on ebay, then I am not fully human 103cm long 647g. It is just like examples illustrated in "Ethnology of Vanuatu - An early twentieth century study - Feelix Speiser - Hawai University Press" I also show it the same ebay style. Attached Images

26th August 2009, 01:06 PM	#8
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	It does indeed Colin, but then again it does not? Attached Images Last edited by Tim Simmons; 26th August 2009 at 02:20 PM.

26th August 2009, 02:33 PM	#9
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	These do not help either, Africa stuck between the Solomons and Fiji/Samoa. Attached Images

26th August 2009, 05:46 PM	#10
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Hoping not to bore everyone to tears I just want to add this. The reason I am thinking this is a pole club is by the weight and that niether end has ever been in contact with the ground. This makes me feel it is a cared for weapon that may have taken considerable effort to make with limited access to steel tools? Pictures of the ends, also an interesting picure of Samburu sticks from "Cradle of Mankind - Mohamed Amin" these are to some degree more crude and do have contact with the ground. Attached Images

25th August 2009, 09:50 PM	#3
graeme gt Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 97	Nice looking timber sort of rosewoody .

25th August 2009, 10:24 PM	#4
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	As far as I have found out there is an Eastern Australian and one would assume the same with Australasian Islands too, a Rosewood, but that is just a trade name as scientifically it is not a true rosewood. "fearn" might be able to help as he is a botanist.

26th August 2009, 12:28 AM	#5
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Not touching the ID on this until I get a better idea where it came from. Rosewood is a messy term, and while I agree that it looks "rosewoody," but there are a lot of dark tropical timbers, and I'll need to dig to get a better answer. The smaller a geographical area I have to dig in, the better. Are we saying Vanuatu for certain, or was that a guess? F

26th August 2009, 08:23 AM	#6
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Thanks fearn, pretty much what I expected. I cannot be certain it is from Vanuatu. It could be from many other Islands but it does fit with illustrations in the afore mentioned publication.

26th August 2009, 09:25 AM	#7
colin henshaw Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,430	Hi Tim I'm fairly sure this is African Blackwood - it looks like an East African stick, probably Masai or nearby. Regards

26th August 2009, 09:44 PM	#11
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi Tim, Actually, that does help. Although we both know that there are a lot of blackwoods and rosewoods in the tropics, this is a good lesson in how hard it can be to attempt to trace a club based on the wood it is made from. It wood actually be easier to do it from the smell of the wood that the color, at least theoretically. Stylistically, I think you've got a point, which is that this stick doesn't seem to have been a generic walking stick (due to lack of scarring from the ground), and I'm comfortable calling it a pole club. Best, F