Bosun's cosh/starter/persuader

kronckew · 29th February 2016, 05:44 PM

naval memorabilia. billed as early 19th century. a bosun's cosh, used on his own sailor's as needed to 'start' or 'persuade' them that did not move fast enough. would be a fearsome weapon tho.

22 in. long. lead egg head covered in typical naval knotwork, malacca shaft, nicely spliced loop of hemp rope at the end. the knotwork appears relatively new, i suspect replaced for display, but it looks right for a proper bosun's work.

fernando · 29th February 2016, 05:58 PM

The type of thing to be posted in the Miscellania section

.

kronckew · 29th February 2016, 06:41 PM

wasn't sure, as it is sort of a weapon/naval badge of rank....

drac2k · 1st March 2016, 05:04 PM

I always liked these "method of enlightened persuasion," items.I remember talking to an old U.S.Navy WW2 Chief Warrant Officer who relayed how when he was newly enlisted in the U.S. Navy, aboard the ship, participating in the "non- voluntary," brass polishing period. He was laying on his side, gently caressing the brass, when much to his surprise, he was startled by the rather rough application of the bosun's foot to his rear . The bosun gave him a look and the meaning was understood; he told me that after that, he was the "brass polishing," champion.This was the age of on deck boxing smokers and such.
Imagine if that was tried today with a modern day sailor.

kronckew · 2nd March 2016, 10:19 AM

item was teleported to me this morning, slightly before the vendor mailed it, i think. probably dipped in asmovian theotimoline.

anyway, the photo colours are off. the head twine is actually quite brown, though lighter than the haft, very tightly done, no cuts, and the malacca rattan haft is intact with a few small dents, a couple of tar stains and a slight split near the lanyard hole, and a small chunk is missing. end shows a typical rattan x-section with the typical tear-drop ridge of malacca. the missing piece exposes the rattan interior and looks well aged, it has been missing for a good while.

the lanyard is neatly spliced, and is not hemp, but a smoother material, possibly cotton 'small stuff'. it is the same colour as the cotton twine knot-work over the lead, both almost exactly the colour of the exposed rattan interior. length is actually 20.25 in. (~55cm.), just under an inch haft dia. & 360 grams in weight.

VANDOO · 4th March 2016, 04:28 PM

THERE WERE QUITE A VARIETY OF THESE I HAVE SEEN SOME DOUBLE ENDED ONES ABOUT 12 INCHES LONG OR LESS AND WERE EASILY CONCEALED. THE HANDLE WAS MADE OF WHALE BALEEN SO WAS FLEXIBLE WHICH ADDED TO THE POWER OF THE STRIKE MUCH LIKE THE LEATHER BLACKJACKS OR SAPS. A MUCH SHORTER SWING WAS NEEDED TO GET THE DESIRED EFFECT AS WELL. THE HISTORY OF THESE IS A DARK ONE AS THEY WERE OFTEN USED BY PRESS GANGS TO KIDNAP (SHANGHAI) OR OTHERWISE IMPRESS MEN AGAINST THEIR WILL TO CREW THEIR SHIPS. THEY WERE EASILY CONCEALED AND COULD BE USED BY AN EXPERT WITHOUT NOTICE OR BLOOD SO WERE USED BY THIEVES TO MUG AND ROB THE UNWARY OR DRUNKS. A LOVE TAP BEHIND THE EAR WHEN NO ONE WAS LOOKING AND HELP YOUR DRUNK FRIEND OUTSIDE TO GET SOME AIR AND THEN AWAY WITH HIS GOODS AND PERHAPS DELIVER HIM TO A SHIP FOR FURTHER GAIN. YOURS IS A NICE EXAMPLE LIKELY USED ON SHIP OR PERHAPS ASHORE OCCASIONALLY BY A PRESS GANG RATHER THAN BY A THIEF.

LJ · 12th March 2016, 09:59 PM

Just to complicate things further. This was part of a collection of unidentified African items, so because my brain runs in straight lines and bearing in mind the copper wire wrapping, my first thought was it was from southern Africa. And the flexible fibre ... possibly elephant hair. Somebody else commented that it looked like the type of staff carried by an Induna.

Well, if the fibre is baleen, it is unlikely to be southern African ! The ends are not particularly heavy, and I never thought of the item as a cosh, but maybe it is.

A sorry descent, from Induna's staff to fish-killing cosh ... or does anybody have a suggestion as to what else could it be ???

kronckew · 13th March 2016, 09:19 AM

yes, not a fishing 'priest', but a very expensive (now) twisted whale baleen bosun's 'starter'. it doesn't need to be all that heavy, it's meant to just provide a painful 'reminder' rather than do injury that might limit the recipient's performance. and to serve as a badge of his top rank in the crew. used a bit like a smack on the head by leroy gibbs (NCIS)

possibly made on a whaler where it did not also need to serve as a weapon.

worth a lot more than a zulu induna's staff.

see my PM.

LJ · 13th March 2016, 06:54 PM

Many thanks for the suggestion. A "bosun's starter" is certainly a more interesting type of object than a fish basher!

The shaft is flexible and whippy, and I could imagine that it would hurt if you were hit by an end.

29th February 2016, 05:44 PM	#1
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,181	Bosun's cosh/starter/persuader naval memorabilia. billed as early 19th century. a bosun's cosh, used on his own sailor's as needed to 'start' or 'persuade' them that did not move fast enough. would be a fearsome weapon tho. 22 in. long. lead egg head covered in typical naval knotwork, malacca shaft, nicely spliced loop of hemp rope at the end. the knotwork appears relatively new, i suspect replaced for display, but it looks right for a proper bosun's work. Attached Images

12th March 2016, 09:59 PM	#7
LJ Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 93	Just to complicate things further. This was part of a collection of unidentified African items, so because my brain runs in straight lines and bearing in mind the copper wire wrapping, my first thought was it was from southern Africa. And the flexible fibre ... possibly elephant hair. Somebody else commented that it looked like the type of staff carried by an Induna. Well, if the fibre is baleen, it is unlikely to be southern African ! The ends are not particularly heavy, and I never thought of the item as a cosh, but maybe it is. A sorry descent, from Induna's staff to fish-killing cosh ... or does anybody have a suggestion as to what else could it be ??? Attached Images

29th February 2016, 05:58 PM	#2
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	The type of thing to be posted in the Miscellania section .

29th February 2016, 06:41 PM	#3
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,181	wasn't sure, as it is sort of a weapon/naval badge of rank....

1st March 2016, 05:04 PM	#4
drac2k Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 1,230	I always liked these "method of enlightened persuasion," items.I remember talking to an old U.S.Navy WW2 Chief Warrant Officer who relayed how when he was newly enlisted in the U.S. Navy, aboard the ship, participating in the "non- voluntary," brass polishing period. He was laying on his side, gently caressing the brass, when much to his surprise, he was startled by the rather rough application of the bosun's foot to his rear . The bosun gave him a look and the meaning was understood; he told me that after that, he was the "brass polishing," champion.This was the age of on deck boxing smokers and such. Imagine if that was tried today with a modern day sailor.

2nd March 2016, 10:19 AM	#5
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,181	item was teleported to me this morning, slightly before the vendor mailed it, i think. probably dipped in asmovian theotimoline. anyway, the photo colours are off. the head twine is actually quite brown, though lighter than the haft, very tightly done, no cuts, and the malacca rattan haft is intact with a few small dents, a couple of tar stains and a slight split near the lanyard hole, and a small chunk is missing. end shows a typical rattan x-section with the typical tear-drop ridge of malacca. the missing piece exposes the rattan interior and looks well aged, it has been missing for a good while. the lanyard is neatly spliced, and is not hemp, but a smoother material, possibly cotton 'small stuff'. it is the same colour as the cotton twine knot-work over the lead, both almost exactly the colour of the exposed rattan interior. length is actually 20.25 in. (~55cm.), just under an inch haft dia. & 360 grams in weight.

4th March 2016, 04:28 PM	#6
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	THERE WERE QUITE A VARIETY OF THESE I HAVE SEEN SOME DOUBLE ENDED ONES ABOUT 12 INCHES LONG OR LESS AND WERE EASILY CONCEALED. THE HANDLE WAS MADE OF WHALE BALEEN SO WAS FLEXIBLE WHICH ADDED TO THE POWER OF THE STRIKE MUCH LIKE THE LEATHER BLACKJACKS OR SAPS. A MUCH SHORTER SWING WAS NEEDED TO GET THE DESIRED EFFECT AS WELL. THE HISTORY OF THESE IS A DARK ONE AS THEY WERE OFTEN USED BY PRESS GANGS TO KIDNAP (SHANGHAI) OR OTHERWISE IMPRESS MEN AGAINST THEIR WILL TO CREW THEIR SHIPS. THEY WERE EASILY CONCEALED AND COULD BE USED BY AN EXPERT WITHOUT NOTICE OR BLOOD SO WERE USED BY THIEVES TO MUG AND ROB THE UNWARY OR DRUNKS. A LOVE TAP BEHIND THE EAR WHEN NO ONE WAS LOOKING AND HELP YOUR DRUNK FRIEND OUTSIDE TO GET SOME AIR AND THEN AWAY WITH HIS GOODS AND PERHAPS DELIVER HIM TO A SHIP FOR FURTHER GAIN. YOURS IS A NICE EXAMPLE LIKELY USED ON SHIP OR PERHAPS ASHORE OCCASIONALLY BY A PRESS GANG RATHER THAN BY A THIEF.

13th March 2016, 09:19 AM	#8
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,181	yes, not a fishing 'priest', but a very expensive (now) twisted whale baleen bosun's 'starter'. it doesn't need to be all that heavy, it's meant to just provide a painful 'reminder' rather than do injury that might limit the recipient's performance. and to serve as a badge of his top rank in the crew. used a bit like a smack on the head by leroy gibbs (NCIS) possibly made on a whaler where it did not also need to serve as a weapon. worth a lot more than a zulu induna's staff. see my PM.

13th March 2016, 06:54 PM	#9
LJ Member Join Date: Mar 2014 Posts: 93	Many thanks for the suggestion. A "bosun's starter" is certainly a more interesting type of object than a fish basher! The shaft is flexible and whippy, and I could imagine that it would hurt if you were hit by an end.