Scottish Dirk Late 18th Century

Battara · 4th December 2018, 07:10 AM

Well once again I'm over here in this section, only sharing my first Scottish dirk. Due to the shape of the baluster hilt, the silver studs, and screw top, I place this example in the late 18c to early 19c, leaning toward the late 18c.

The first picture is how I got it with a bent blade. The second picture is after my cleaning and restoration.

Battara · 4th December 2018, 07:12 AM

Pictures of the hilt and pommel top.

Battara · 4th December 2018, 07:21 AM

Here are the engravings on the front and back of the silver mounts of the hilt and scabbard. The name: "J McLeod". There is a crown stamp and the pictures of cannons, battle flags, and swords, and spears indicate to me that this person was also an officer in the British military.

My 2 questions:

1. Does the presence of cannons indicate being part of an artillery unit?

2. What does "RB 2" mean?

Other comments welcomed as well.

Rick · 4th December 2018, 06:25 PM

That also looks like a Gorget engraved on one of the panels.
So, officer?

Oh yeah Jose ; "There can be only one.."

Battara · 5th December 2018, 04:30 AM

GOOD POINT RICK! I missed that. Many thanks.

Jim McDougall · 5th December 2018, 05:15 AM

Jose!!! This is an absolutely phenomenal dirk!! and my Highland blood is raging with envy

I have been going through resources for hours and I feel confident this example is much as you have suggested, but I think more toward 1770s because of the wider 'haunches' in the beautifully Celtic knot baluster hilt. The metal studs are of this period to 1790s.
Whitelaw (1908 (1977), p.313) notes that after the Disarming Acts of 1746, following the tragedy at Culloden, proscribed Scots from owning weapons. However the dirk, with its utilitarian purposes was typically permitted, and often the now banned Scottish basket hilts were dismantled and blades repurposed into those for dirks.

This blade seems likely to be one of these blades as its profile seems contrary to most specifically for dirks, and the fuller at the forte resemble known Solingen backsword blade types.

Clearly this dirk is for an officer in a Scottish regiment of the third quarter 18th c.+ as suggested by the military motif, the gorget, sword, cannons and the RB 2 is of course likely a regimental unit. This may well be a heirloom blade mounted in military dress as noted. It would be exciting to imagine that the heirloom blade was in use at the time of Culloden.

The cannon do not suggest artillery ...perhaps the RB 2 could mean Rifle Battalion 2 or some such designation but those units seem much later.

The style of pommel and the mounts predate the familiar stone mounted dirk pommels which began around 1800. It is amazing to have the scabbard also! This is truly amazing Jose, congratulations!

Sources: "The Scottish Dirk" James D. Forman, 1991

"The Scottish Armoury" D. Caldwell, 1979

"Scottish Arms Makers" Charles Whitelaw, 1908 (1977)

" Scottish Swords & Dirks", John Wallace, 1970

Battara · 5th December 2018, 05:43 AM

Oh Jim, I was excited to be able to get this. I am generally not interested in any Scottish dirk past 1800 due to the transformation of the hilt.

Rifle battalion - not thought of that. The hard part is the first name - James or John?

Still researching this. Thanks for your well informed input! I have the first and last references, but not the 2 middle ones.

BTW - I know I have Irish blood, but Scottish - maybe-ish (if so, perhaps from the McKinnon clan who fought alongside the McDonalds with Bonnie prince Charlie at Culloden!).

4th December 2018, 07:10 AM	#1
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Scottish Dirk Late 18th Century Well once again I'm over here in this section, only sharing my first Scottish dirk. Due to the shape of the baluster hilt, the silver studs, and screw top, I place this example in the late 18c to early 19c, leaning toward the late 18c. The first picture is how I got it with a bent blade. The second picture is after my cleaning and restoration. Attached Images

4th December 2018, 07:12 AM	#2
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Pictures of the hilt and pommel top. Attached Images

4th December 2018, 07:21 AM	#3
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Here are the engravings on the front and back of the silver mounts of the hilt and scabbard. The name: "J McLeod". There is a crown stamp and the pictures of cannons, battle flags, and swords, and spears indicate to me that this person was also an officer in the British military. My 2 questions: 1. Does the presence of cannons indicate being part of an artillery unit? 2. What does "RB 2" mean? Other comments welcomed as well. Attached Images

4th December 2018, 06:25 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	That also looks like a Gorget engraved on one of the panels. So, officer? Oh yeah Jose ; "There can be only one.."

5th December 2018, 04:30 AM	#5
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	GOOD POINT RICK! I missed that. Many thanks.

5th December 2018, 05:15 AM	#6
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 9,945	Jose!!! This is an absolutely phenomenal dirk!! and my Highland blood is raging with envy I have been going through resources for hours and I feel confident this example is much as you have suggested, but I think more toward 1770s because of the wider 'haunches' in the beautifully Celtic knot baluster hilt. The metal studs are of this period to 1790s. Whitelaw (1908 (1977), p.313) notes that after the Disarming Acts of 1746, following the tragedy at Culloden, proscribed Scots from owning weapons. However the dirk, with its utilitarian purposes was typically permitted, and often the now banned Scottish basket hilts were dismantled and blades repurposed into those for dirks. This blade seems likely to be one of these blades as its profile seems contrary to most specifically for dirks, and the fuller at the forte resemble known Solingen backsword blade types. Clearly this dirk is for an officer in a Scottish regiment of the third quarter 18th c.+ as suggested by the military motif, the gorget, sword, cannons and the RB 2 is of course likely a regimental unit. This may well be a heirloom blade mounted in military dress as noted. It would be exciting to imagine that the heirloom blade was in use at the time of Culloden. The cannon do not suggest artillery ...perhaps the RB 2 could mean Rifle Battalion 2 or some such designation but those units seem much later. The style of pommel and the mounts predate the familiar stone mounted dirk pommels which began around 1800. It is amazing to have the scabbard also! This is truly amazing Jose, congratulations! Sources: "The Scottish Dirk" James D. Forman, 1991 "The Scottish Armoury" D. Caldwell, 1979 "Scottish Arms Makers" Charles Whitelaw, 1908 (1977) " Scottish Swords & Dirks", John Wallace, 1970

5th December 2018, 05:43 AM	#7
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Oh Jim, I was excited to be able to get this. I am generally not interested in any Scottish dirk past 1800 due to the transformation of the hilt. Rifle battalion - not thought of that. The hard part is the first name - James or John? Still researching this. Thanks for your well informed input! I have the first and last references, but not the 2 middle ones. BTW - I know I have Irish blood, but Scottish - maybe-ish (if so, perhaps from the McKinnon clan who fought alongside the McDonalds with Bonnie prince Charlie at Culloden!).