Kerises in different cultural spheres

Jussi M. · 27th February 2010, 03:10 PM

Greetings,

on many occasions we look at the kerises as cultural artifacts frozen in the time and place that gave birth to them. However, due to modern technology our appreciation of time and space has changed. - They are not the boundaries they once were. These days the keris has truly become an international phenomena (in the form of collecting and study) and they can be found on places as remote and alien to the original cultural sphere they originated in as this:

Yeah... Snow. Lots of it. Took these pics today and wondered how might the kerises be like if the Indonesian Archipelago would looked liked this a few centuries ago?

Do we want it or not the world functions as systemic whole leading to cultural change and interchange everywhere. The keris too is not immune but a part of this change.

Thanks,

J.

Jussi M. · 27th February 2010, 04:09 PM

Forgot to say...

The location of above pictures is 100km from Helsinki, Southern Finland, EU.

Thanks,

J.

Rick · 27th February 2010, 05:21 PM

Looks like you're having a mild winter .

Jussi M. · 27th February 2010, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Looks like you're having a mild winter .

Sure...

Rick · 27th February 2010, 11:05 PM

You took that picture at high noon, didn't you ?

Jussi M. · 27th February 2010, 11:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

You took that picture at high noon, didn't you ?

Nah, about eight o´clock in the evening or so after seeing yours. Decided to make a homage to it so dug the Keris out of it´s rest place, laid it against the window for a minute and took a a couple quick and dirty pics of which the shown was the best of.

I guess I am not much of a photographer Rick

Best,

J.

BluErf · 28th February 2010, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Looks like you're having a mild winter .

Beautiful wood grains! I love this keris!

Isn't the ukiran in a rather Malay/Bugis position?

If the keris were to have developed in Scandinavia, I bet it would likely have fur-coated sheaths

A. G. Maisey · 1st March 2010, 07:38 AM

Our winter:- 25 June 2009 (middle of winter) at our place.

David · 1st March 2010, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Our winter:- 25 June 2009 (middle of winter) at our place.

You have to rub it in, don't you Alan...

kronckew · 3rd March 2010, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BluErf

...

If the keris were to have developed in Scandinavia, I bet it would likely have fur-coated sheaths

i have a malay/indonesian pirate klewang in a fur-coated sheath. of course most of the fur has worn off now.

and david, one of the most expensive coffees comes from there, apparently they get a civert cat to eat the coffee fruits, and it poops out the beans and they charge a small fortune for them (kopi luwak). supposedly tastes heavenly, but as i've never had the pleasure, maybe some one else can comment

edited:
p.s. - from the reference wiki article in the para. above, kopi muncak may be possible here, we have a number of muntjac deer in residence on the neighbourhood farms where i walk the greyhounds, i'll have to leave out some unroasted coffee beans hidden in some fruit and see what happens. Kopi manusia is another possibility

David · 3rd March 2010, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kronckew

and david, one of the most expensive coffees comes from there, apparently they get a civert cat to eat the coffee fruits, and it poops out the beans and they charge a small fortune for them (kopi luwak). supposedly tastes heavenly, but as i've never had the pleasure, maybe some one else can comment

Yes Kronckew. i used to sell coffee for a living so i am aware of this special brew. I haven't had the pleasure yet either...

laEspadaAncha · 27th February 2010, 05:41 PM

While unashamedly an admitted novice on the keris, as an armchair student of history, I would think that given the "backend" religious factors driving the "front-end" cultural expression of the keris, it is a fair assumption the only realized difference resulting from a change in climate might have been in the materials (i.e., type of wood) used in creating the ukiran, warangka, & gambar. Snow did not keep the Hindu religion from flourishing in the Himalayas; and the same forms of weaponry with only slight-to-moderate variations may be found along a wide range of latitudes from mountain peaks of Nepal to the tropical southern subcontinent.

Of course, take my opinion for what it is worth: exactly what it cost...

Now, on the other hand, if you're speaking of how the keris may have developed had it been indigenous to Finland, I think it might have looked something like this:

27th February 2010, 03:10 PM	#1
Jussi M. Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 235	Kerises in different cultural spheres Greetings, on many occasions we look at the kerises as cultural artifacts frozen in the time and place that gave birth to them. However, due to modern technology our appreciation of time and space has changed. - They are not the boundaries they once were. These days the keris has truly become an international phenomena (in the form of collecting and study) and they can be found on places as remote and alien to the original cultural sphere they originated in as this: Yeah... Snow. Lots of it. Took these pics today and wondered how might the kerises be like if the Indonesian Archipelago would looked liked this a few centuries ago? Do we want it or not the world functions as systemic whole leading to cultural change and interchange everywhere. The keris too is not immune but a part of this change. Thanks, J. Last edited by Jussi M.; 27th February 2010 at 03:35 PM.

27th February 2010, 05:21 PM	#3
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Looks like you're having a mild winter . Attached Images

1st March 2010, 07:38 AM	#8
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,893	Our winter:- 25 June 2009 (middle of winter) at our place. Attached Images

27th February 2010, 04:09 PM	#2
Jussi M. Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 235	Forgot to say... The location of above pictures is 100km from Helsinki, Southern Finland, EU. Thanks, J.

27th February 2010, 11:05 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	You took that picture at high noon, didn't you ?

27th February 2010, 05:41 PM	#12
laEspadaAncha Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 608	While unashamedly an admitted novice on the keris, as an armchair student of history, I would think that given the "backend" religious factors driving the "front-end" cultural expression of the keris, it is a fair assumption the only realized difference resulting from a change in climate might have been in the materials (i.e., type of wood) used in creating the ukiran, warangka, & gambar. Snow did not keep the Hindu religion from flourishing in the Himalayas; and the same forms of weaponry with only slight-to-moderate variations may be found along a wide range of latitudes from mountain peaks of Nepal to the tropical southern subcontinent. Of course, take my opinion for what it is worth: exactly what it cost... Now, on the other hand, if you're speaking of how the keris may have developed had it been indigenous to Finland, I think it might have looked something like this: