Boomerang information? region?

[Tim Simmons]

This has been hanging around for a while. I show it as we seem to have a member that may be able to give more information as to where it is from in Aus or if junk. I do not know if it is old but saying that I do not feel it is recent. I imagine early 20th cent?. 72cm from tip to tip in a straight line. The wood is not particularly heavy. The boomerang has a wing profile as you would expect but also a slight twist like a propeller blade. my pics are not that good. The wood is reddish brown that has been blackened perhaps charred? {hardening ?} and polished. Then the surface appears to have been scraped and or rubbed back. I have to say the carved decoration under x10 mag does not appear to have been made by metal tools but nothing sensational in that. Opinions. Go on I can take it.

[katana]

Hi Tim,
I'm not certain, but the grooved 'decoration' may be more functional than decorative. I believe the grooves create air turbulence that is beneficial to the flight of the boomerang.....suggesting to me that this is a 'goodie'

I believe a similar effect is demonstrated by the 'dimples' in a golf ball .

Regards David

[fearn]

Superficially it looks genuine, although I think it's probably a kylie (non-returning hunter) rather than a boomerang (returning toy). A boomerang would have a much less obtuse angle. I've seen plenty of pics of kylies with those grooves, what bothers me is the check pattern at the end. If genuine, I'd guess some Central tribe, and I don't have to book with me to guess better than that.

Here are some suggestions for determining whether it's genuine.

1) wood grain: does it run down the length of the kylie (i.e. did they use a bent branch) or does the grain run out the side (i.e. they used a board). Extra points if there's evidence that the wood was bent under heat prior to shaping, as seen by charred spots on the wood (they had to use a campfire to heat the green wood).

2) Cross-sectional shape. If it looks like a wing, with the grooves on the upper side, it's more likely an art object

3). Damage on the edges. A genuine, used kylie would show marks from hitting kangaroos, being used as an impromptu digging stick, starting a friction fire, etc. An art object will be in better shape.

4) The hard one: throw it. Gently. At a soft target (think grassland, haybales, etc.). I'm not a boomerang maker, but there's a wonderful book (Primitive Technology, A Book of Earth SkillsPrimitive Technology, A Book of Earth Skills) that goes into the process of making a kylie in detail. The final part is that you've got to tune the thing so that it flies straight, and if it's an art object, it hasn't been tuned to throw. While the piece is old and quite possibly distorted, if it flies straight when thrown, someone took the time to make it work, and it's genuine.

My 0.02 cents,

F

[Tim Simmons]

Hello fearn, obviously I hope it is the real thing although there is little to suggest damage from use, like a lot of weapons. The scraping back of the wood makes sense. The carving would have to some degree a harsh and uneven surface, so it is then scraped back to a smooth aerodynamic form like the golf ball mention earlier. By the way what do you make of this African bean rattle you botanist huh.

[fearn]

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

By the way what do you make of this African bean rattle you botanist huh.

Love those things. I used to whack students with 'em when I was teaching. Really Actually, it's always fun putting those down with a tahitian chestnut, a sea bean, a screw mesquite, and a couple of others, and saying, "yep, those are all beans, and they'll on be on the test." Their eyes are sooooo expressive.

F

[Lew]

[QUOTE=fearn]Superficially it looks genuine, although I think it's probably a kylie (non-returning hunter) rather than a boomerang (returning toy).

Tim

Here is the ultimate test.. Mail it to me and if you get it back it's a boomerang if it stays with me it's a kylie Either way it's quite nice!

Congrats


Lew

[katana]

[QUOTE=LOUIEBLADES]

Originally Posted by fearn

Superficially it looks genuine, although I think it's probably a kylie (non-returning hunter) rather than a boomerang (returning toy).



Here is the ultimate test.. Mail it to me and if you get it back it's a boomerang if it stays with me it's a kylie
Lew

[ausjulius]

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

This has been hanging around for a while. I show it as we seem to have a member that may be able to give more information as to where it is from in Aus or if junk. I do not know if it is old but saying that I do not feel it is recent. I imagine early 20th cent?. 72cm from tip to tip in a straight line. The wood is not particularly heavy. The boomerang has a wing profile as you would expect but also a slight twist like a propeller blade. my pics are not that good. The wood is reddish brown that has been blackened perhaps charred? {hardening ?} and polished. Then the surface appears to have been scraped and or rubbed back. I have to say the carved decoration under x10 mag does not appear to have been made by metal tools but nothing sensational in that. Opinions. Go on I can take it.

is cut with steel tools and or glass, recently made, proably central desert region , remember the steel tools were very cude, sharpened nails and fenching wire... and bits or sharpened metal ,, not tools,

the blackened grooves are done with heated fencing wire
they heat it up in the fire and then draw on the patterns, or carve in the patterns and then go over with the hot wire,
wood is australian,
but i cant see it clearly to tell you what species for shure,
australian snake wood is popular as is black wattle roots and some other gum roots.
id say this is proably from the branch of a gum tree, proably in the y section where the branch begins,
as it is not looking as dence as a root, for exsample,
how heavy is it, and how thin is it,

yes very few ethnic groups in asutralia are known to make returing boomarangs the ,youlingu ,, also these folk are the makers of the digeridoo (although some of the other smaller groups in the area also use this instriment )
,, mostly the returning boomarangs were toys, or for scearing magpie geese ,, and they mainted the black and white like a sea eagle to scare them to fly low so they could spear them to chase them into bird nets,

maybe some other abboriginal groups used returning boomarangs but most likely only as a toy for kids,

most real fighting or hunting boomarangs are sharp and realy quite thin and lite.
the slight twist would suggest it is comming from one of the peoples of southern northen territory below alice springs or in the area of south australia, as there this twist was common it makes the boomarang fly on a uneven path making it harder for the target to dodge, but the thrower knows this parth and can calculate the point of impact.

could be real , as in made for a weapon , could be tourist peice as in a real item made for a cattel station worker or government worker in the area or could be a misson exsample made fro mission shops..
at an reate it ir hard to tel as they used these tools up untill recently , in the 60s in south australia for exsample there was still wild groups in the desert , adn they still used and made these itmes and frequently used them as weapons in the 80s on the misson settelments and in camps around these,
and even today these are still made and used although must less so than say 20 years ago,

like i said ive seen people still carry and use throwing clubs and spears in the present day,, and the most natives dont possess a gun and it is hard for them to get, these items are common in inter-ethnic dusputs in the abboriginal communities,
pupunya would be a good place to see this stuff in common use or in port keats, although there firearms and machetes and such are common , although proably in most abboriginal settelments you will still find these being made,

when ther eis a fight or dispute over black magic or a death cause by a member of another clan or ethnic group they will commonly attempt to exstract revenge in the form of killing or wounding the offending groups leading members , ordemand a trial where they can obtain payback, mostly in the form of inflicting a wounding with a speat to the leg or club or booarang to the leg or head :O

thes wepaons are ues frequently enougth that there is common cases when the police and army will close down communitis and speerate the different ethnic groups,, and disarm them of their weapons,, .

normaly big bundles of fighting clubs and spears make the bulk of this ,

i had for exsample a newly made boomarang from central australia and one about 90 years old, the newly made one was recently made and made to be used as a wepaon there was no difference between the 90 year old one and the new one,, ..only some color with age,

that being said, due to my experience with the natives in australia, id say , mostly they are not so busy to make money, and it is rather uncommon for them to reproduce these items in any bulk for tourists. and the most dont see many tourists either, except maybe other australians comming for fishing trips ,

s as far as i know there realy isnt any shops you can buy realy weapons now, as the mission shops are all gone many years ago


s how do you tell if yours was made and then used and not made for the mission shop preist , well look it is has areas that have secived impact, and loo at the wear of the wood, the wood will take on a polished look after a while this is a good signe it has been used, and handle ,

as the natives lacked any ability to polish to finish their wooden items, .

hope this helps,
sorry for the long post.

[katana]

Hi (G'day ) Ausjulius,

fantastic information, thank you. Could you post pics of the two boomerangs you mentioned.

Regards David

[Tim Simmons]

These pics help get some idea of the thing. It is interesting how weapons all over the world have very similar sizes. The knobkerrie on the right is 313g the boomerang is 359g and the other knobkerrie is 372g. Even if it was used as a sword club it would be quite effective easily breaking a collar bone, damaging the face and even the skull. The maximum thickness is 13mm. There is some polish to the item, not like the 19th century knobkerries. I am happy with mid 20th century. No signs of use as with the knobkerries for all that matters, but that is not unusual on many items we collect . The pics are interesting?

[ausjulius]

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

These pics help get some idea of the thing. It is interesting how weapons all over the world have very similar sizes. The knobkerrie on the right is 313g the boomerang is 359g and the other knobkerrie is 372g. Even if it was used as a sword club it would be quite effective easily breaking a collar bone, damaging the face and even the skull. The maximum thickness is 13mm. There is some polish to the item, not like the 19th century knobkerries. I am happy with mid 20th century. No signs of use as with the knobkerries for all that matters, but that is not unusual on many items we collect . The pics are interesting?

yes many types of boomerang were used as clubs aswell, and even in north queensland was a wooden sword type of boomerany used with a length or over 1 meter. i dont know if that beast could be thrown well , :O
the one you have it is gripped by the fatter scaled end and thrown..
i would say it is proably for hunting, not specificaly as a weapon,

it is an original item and not a tourist item,
and although i cant say the age just from looking at it, i can say that if it has taken a smooth surface then it proably has some age,
looking at it and as the pattern etched with hot wire id say it would date from after ww1- the 1970s... as newer wouldnt take much smooth finish purely from handling, also most newer genuine boomerangs ive seen were mostly just fighting boomerangs,, like the number 7 and such and not suted to hunting, i dont think there is any hunting with boomerangs now


some points to look out for for fake or tourist aboriginal items are smooth finishes,, as are thick heavy items or itmes made from incorrect wood,
general all abboriginal itmes are left with a rougth surface.
also most types of boomerang are sharpe and with be sharpened at the tips to a good edge,, on a fake this will not be..

katana, thanks mate alas i left most of this stuff in australia,,... and have given alot away i had a big collection of native weapons , aspecialy spears and spear throwers,, and alot of wepoans and such from png and the pacific ..
i gave most of the png bows and axes away,, aswell as most of the abboriginal dishes and weapons
and most of the aboriginal paintings and weapons , well i gave a 40 years old youlingu bark painting to my girlfirends father at one point :O.. my should have sold that one :S..
others are still at my home some place in australia,, i didnt foto much of the stuff as i didnt realy have a camera last time i was there :O.

i can proably get pictures of some of the stuff or other peoples stuff if you wish, i can proably get fotos of recently made weapons made for use, made in the 80s and 90s,

P.s. i must update my detials, im nolonger living in dagestan ,.. now i live in canada hence the inuit and indian knife fotos ...and not dagestani weapons