id request marking on touareg sword

Congoblades · 23rd September 2012, 03:39 PM

Hi, someone seen this mark before?
It's not mine, these are the only pictures I have.

Iain · 23rd September 2012, 04:19 PM

That's a new one to me. Hard to tell from the photos if its scratched (probably locally applied) or stamped (probably original).

Best guess at the moment would be a stamp on the steel used for the blade. As the sword overall doesn't look particularly old it could be made from recycled steel in which case this could make some sense.

Otherwise its nothing like traditional talisman markings and copies of older European marks I've seen on takouba.

Interesting thing for sure. Is it owned by a friend of yours and perhaps we could get better images?

Congoblades · 23rd September 2012, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iain

Best guess at the moment would be a stamp on the steel used for the blade. As the sword overall doesn't look particularly old it could be made from recycled steel in which case this could make some sense.
?

Thanks Iain. Intresting point of view, this make sence. the sword was pretty thin and flexible, not really battleready, but then there was this stamp... lol
It was collected in the early seventies in the Sahel.
It's not from a friend, I wanted to buy it but didn'nt, lucky me

Iain · 23rd September 2012, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Congoblades

Thanks Iain. Intresting point of view, this make sence. the sword was pretty thin and flexible, not really battleready, but then there was this stamp... lol
It was collected in the early seventies in the Sahel.
It's not from a friend, I wanted to buy it but didn'nt, lucky me

Best idea I have at the moment.

This happens on takouba and kaskara from the 20th century on. Any piece of good steel was used and recycled into everything from swords to arm daggers. Thin and flexible is not a bad thing for a takouba.

1970s sounds exactly right for how this looks. Pretty typical sword and usually very easy to find takouba of this quality.

Dom · 23rd September 2012, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Congoblades

Hi, someone seen this mark before?

Hello Congoblades
little bit complicated that mark, because at least, is contained three (3)
indications

1) location; Vendée,region in west central France, on the Atlantic Ocean
"Vendée" has been after French revolution (1789) a land of rebellion.
Their motto in battle was "Vive le roi!" and "Vive les bons prêtres!";
Long live the King, Long live the good priests and Long live the faith!
they was bearing on their clothes that "heart overcome a cross"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vend%C3%A9e

2) the marine anchor, may indicated either that the guy was a seaman, or more probably,
belonging to "colonial troops" they have this badge (anchor)

3) I didn't found an explanation for the "F. S. A." I'm confused my sagacity is at fault ...

à +

Dom

Congoblades · 23rd September 2012, 07:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dom

2) the marine anchor, may indicated either that the guy was a seaman, or more probably,
belonging to "colonial troops" they have this badge (anchor)

Hi Dom,
Maybe this? My french is not to good, so you will understand it better than me

http://infos.fncv.com/post/2011/10/0...ts-ecologistes

The heart&cross logo is apparently still in use...
Greets
Guy

Dom · 24th September 2012, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Congoblades

Hi Dom,
Maybe this? My french is not to good, so you will understand it better than me

http://infos.fncv.com/post/2011/10/0...ts-ecologistes

The heart&cross logo is apparently still in use...
Greets
Guy

Hi Guy
according with your link, it's exactly what I was suggesting you

Marine Infantry Regiment (RIMA) is a regiment of naval troops (army) of the French Army,
R.I.Ma = Régiment Infanterie de Marine either "Marines" like US

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/French_Colonial_Forces
the badge attached (pic), is the official French Army beret badge for all R.I.Ma
many troops from "Coloniale" have been to Sahara, residence for the Tuaregs, not strange to find this mark

The heart&cross logo is apparently still in use..., yes for sure, for the nostalgic of the royalty ...

ps/ your link attached was concerning a political fight between,
- some who support Army, and
- "green" who hate Army,
the "greens" was accusing the "R.I.Ma" of
"Colonialism, Militarism and religious proselytism" ... because

the Colonial's shout is, "in the name of God" - "Vive la colonial"
too much for them (green), who are anti-militarist, anti-clerical

too long to develop all argumentation, I was NCO during my military service,
as for me, the army is "sacred", it is not negotiable

à +

Dom

attached a pic for a badge of "Colonial regiment in Sahara",

Established in 1903 as a group of N'Guigmi meharist (camel riders) .
Becomes nomadic group N'Guigmi 1 January 1958.
Becomes nomadic group No. 9 on 1 December 1958.
Becomes nomadic 9egroupe 1 January 1961.
Dissolved on 30 September 1962.

Explanation of symbols
The head of camel and palm symbolizes the vocation of the unit
you have your evidence ... camel = Tuareg + anchor for "R.I.Ma"

Ferguson · 24th September 2012, 01:56 AM

http://www.toytowngermany.com/lofi/i...hp/t63614.html

Symbol looks very similar

"The cross, the anchor, and the heart represent the three theological virtues of faith, hope and charity respectivily. It is based on the cross and anchor symbol used by the early Christians in the catacombs, the added heart representing humanity. Many Catholic missionary services use this symbol."

Steve

Iain · 24th September 2012, 09:32 AM

I think the French military connection looks very probable now - if the mark is "scratched" and not stamped it seems likely a French service member could have requested it when purchasing or ordering the sword.

Dom · 24th September 2012, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ferguson

http://www.toytowngermany.com/lofi/i...hp/t63614.html Symbol looks very similar

Good Day Steve
may I bring a precision about the cross that you display

this particular cross, has an history, and signification, unfortunately, not exactly as you mentionned

your cross, it's a "Camargue" cross ...

the Camargue cross is an emblem created by the artist Hermann Paul in 1924 at the request of the Marquis Folco de Baroncelli.
the cross for faith
the anchor for hope
the heart for love
the three-pronged forks at the top not only represent tridents, but also the tool used by "manadiers" (cowboys) (manade; is as bull farm established on Rhone delta, front to Mediterranean sea) see for more details http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manade

all the best

à +

Dom

23rd September 2012, 03:39 PM	#1
Congoblades Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Belgium Posts: 171	id request marking on touareg sword Hi, someone seen this mark before? It's not mine, these are the only pictures I have. Attached Images

24th September 2012, 01:56 AM	#8
Ferguson Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Kernersville, NC, USA Posts: 793	http://www.toytowngermany.com/lofi/i...hp/t63614.html Symbol looks very similar "The cross, the anchor, and the heart represent the three theological virtues of faith, hope and charity respectivily. It is based on the cross and anchor symbol used by the early Christians in the catacombs, the added heart representing humanity. Many Catholic missionary services use this symbol." Steve Attached Images Last edited by Ferguson; 24th September 2012 at 02:14 AM.

23rd September 2012, 04:19 PM	#2
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,693	That's a new one to me. Hard to tell from the photos if its scratched (probably locally applied) or stamped (probably original). Best guess at the moment would be a stamp on the steel used for the blade. As the sword overall doesn't look particularly old it could be made from recycled steel in which case this could make some sense. Otherwise its nothing like traditional talisman markings and copies of older European marks I've seen on takouba. Interesting thing for sure. Is it owned by a friend of yours and perhaps we could get better images?

24th September 2012, 09:32 AM	#9
Iain Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Olomouc Posts: 1,693	I think the French military connection looks very probable now - if the mark is "scratched" and not stamped it seems likely a French service member could have requested it when purchasing or ordering the sword.