Another bright idea from the big brains at Ebay

Lew · 3rd March 2008, 10:13 PM

Just got email today

In recent weeks fraudulent email offers targeting listings under $200 has surged unacceptably. To keep eBay a top shopping destination we must choose safety over visibility and nip this in the bud. We recognize for some of you this may be an unwelcome limitation but we hope you'll support our putting more muscle into fraud prevention.

I called them up and gave them a piece of my mind. I had the customer rep laughing told him I was out bid on a pair of socks the sold for $1.29 and received a second chance email that I can buy it for .99 cents

He agreed that he thinks it's a silly idea but he does not make up their policy

Lew

spiral · 3rd March 2008, 10:40 PM

Soryy Louie I dont understand from your post what have ebay actualy done? Have they banned all second chance offers? if so Is this US only or worlwide? or am i misunderstanding?

Cheers,
Spiral

Berkley · 3rd March 2008, 10:48 PM

Read further - the other shoe dropped:

Quote:

To protect the Community from this growing safety threat, we have made the decision to mask User IDs for bidders on all auction-style listings on eBay.com and Motors. This change will go into effect later this week. Even with all this history and need, we understand that masking User IDs on all auction-style listings is a significant change, and it this is not a step we are taking lightly. However, in light of today's environment - and the damage fake email offers pose to our members and to overall buyer trust in the marketplace – it's imperative we act now to make this change.

So now, for our own safety, shill bids are permitted/encouraged on all eBay auctions

.

ward · 3rd March 2008, 11:17 PM

Why not they raised selling fees 40% and made it so sellers can not leave negative feedback. It is getting very difficult to do business on ebay. Some of their other changes are just as obnoxious.

katana · 3rd March 2008, 11:30 PM

Ebay seems to have lost 'its way'...from its humble beginnings where trust was paramount ...it has grown in a massive marketing machine with new policies that seem to benefit eBay's bank balance.

The real shame is that there isn't another 'big' auction site that could rival eBay. Then buyers and sellers could decide which internet auction site to use... so if people feel new policies were unfair etc they would use the 'other' site....people power.
Unfortunately eBay is almost a monopoly driven by business exec's whom are looking to increase their profits to the detrement of the 'original values' of eBay.

I feel it is becoming riskier to both buy and sell on eBay, hiding ID's will increase that risk ........

Rick · 3rd March 2008, 11:47 PM

I think things there have gotten to the point where astute Sellers and Buyers will take a seriously long look at further participation on their venue .

I would like to see more Dealers open their own websites .
Speaking for myself I would much rather buy directly from someone I can trust .

VANDOO · 3rd March 2008, 11:52 PM

PERHAPS EBAY IS INFECTED WITH THE SAME FORM OF GREED THAT MANY OTHER AUCTIONS SEEM TO BE ATE UP WITH THESE DAYS.

I SUSPECT IT IS NOT UNUSUAL FOR A AUCTION TO CHARGE THE SELLER 20%OR MORE OF THE SALE PRICE AND PERHAPS A FEE FOR LISTING AND ACCEPTING THE ITEM NOT BEING A SELLER I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE CHARGES ARE.

BUT BUYERS ARE CHARGED A 18 TO 20.5% BUYERS PREMIUM FOR THE PRIVILEGE OF BEING ALLOWED TO BUY SOMETHING FROM THE AUCTION. QUITE A PROFIT FOR VERY LITTLE WORK AS FAR AS THE BUYERS AND IF THEY TAKE A LARGER BITE FROM THE SELLER (WHO THEY DO SOME ACTUAL WORK FOR) THEN YOU ARE LOOKING AT A POSSIBLE PROFIT FOR THE AUCTION HOUSE OF 4O TO 50% PERHAPS MORE.

WHEN YOU ADD THE PACKING, SHIPPING ECT WHICH AN INCREASING NUMBER OF ONLINE AUCTIONS LEAVE ENTIRELY UP TO THE BUYER TO ARRANGE WITH NO HELP FROM THEM AS WELL AS A STORAGE CHARGE IF YOUR MERCHANDISE IS NOT PICKED UP IN A SHORT TIME.

IT WOULD APPEAR SOME AUCTIONS EXPECT THE SELLERS TO BE HAPPY WITH ABOUT THE SAME RETURN THEY WOULD GET TAKING THEIR ITEMS TO A PAWN SHOP. PENNYS ON THE DOLLAR FOR THE SELLER AND BIG PROFITS FOR THE AUCTION. A SELLER WILL SEE A HIGHER SALE PRICE ON EBAY OR SOUTHBYS OR CHRISTIES BUT IF MOST OF THE REALIZED PRICE GOES TO THE AUCTION AND YOU END UP WITH WHAT YOU WOULD GET LOCALLY WHY BOTHER WITH THE AUCTION HOUSE?
I HAVE NEVER BOUGHT OR SOLD FROM SOUTHBYS OR CHRISTIES OR SOLD ON EBAY SO DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR CHARGES ARE BUT JUDGING FROM BUYERS PREMIUMS BEING SO HIGH I EXPECT THEM TO ALSO BE HIGH.

THE NEXT THING WE KNOW EBAY WILL HAVE A BUYERS PREMIUM AS WELL AS APPROVED SHILL BIDDING.

Rick · 4th March 2008, 01:49 AM

Totally agree with you Barry .

A Seller would do better in our Swap forum .

So would a Buyer .

Lew · 3rd March 2008, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spiral

Soryy Louie I dont understand from your post what have ebay actualy done? Have they banned all second chance offers? if so Is this US only or worlwide? or am i misunderstanding?

Cheers,
Spiral

Spiral

Ebay currently hides all bidder IDs once the item exceeds $200 the new rule basically will hide all bids from $1.00 on up.

Lew

spiral · 4th March 2008, 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LOUIEBLADES

Spiral

Ebay currently hides all bidder IDs once the item exceeds $200 the new rule basically will hide all bids from $1.00 on up.

Lew

Thanks Lew, I understand. O well ebay is not the place it was years ago. I used to enjoy it, but there were more raritys at cheap prices 6 or 7 years ago.

Spiral

A. G. Maisey · 4th March 2008, 11:39 PM

Lee, I have dealt mainly with one Sydney auction house since I was in high school. Up until perhaps 25 years ago, this organisation charged the seller a 10% commission.

There was no buyer's commission, the operation was plain, simple, no fancy catalogues, no up-market auction rooms. In a word:- basic.

Then they started to get delusions of grandeur, moved out of their dark dusty auction rooms on the edge of Chinatown into a historic building on the edge of the corporate heart of town. Polished floors, elegant lighting, auctioneers in suits and ties.Very beautifully produced catalogues on art paper.Big advertisements in Saturday's newspapers.

Seller's commissions rose, then buyer's commissions were introduced, and over the years it has just got worse. Currently, I think, the seller pays 25%, the buyer pays 22.5%.

I still buy from them. I've never stopped.

But I only ever pay what an item is worth to me. I recently bought an antique Chinese day bed. I knew a new one would cost me about $1500. I would have rather had a new one, than an antique one, so to me, this day bed was worth around $600-700. I lodged a bid of $550 ($550 + 22.5% = $673) with the auctioneer and went home. When I rang back I found I had won the day bed at $450. $450 + 22.5% = $551.Well inside my budget.

What I have found is that all regular buyers at auction adjust their bid downwards to cover the buyer's commission. The only people who do not do this are the occasional buyers who have little or no experience, or who do not have an understanding of the value of something before they start to bid.

I do understand the way in which sniping works on ebay, however, I feel that if you know the value of something, and you are prepared to pay a fair price, then sniping is not necessary. You simply lodge your maximum bid with ebay, and if nobody has placed a higher value on the item, you will win, and ebay will apply sufficient of your maximum bid to allow you to win, even after the auction closes.The whole philosophy of winning at auction is to know the value to you of the item being auctioned, and be prepared to pay that price to buy it. It could well be worth more to somebody else, but that should not concern you:- you have named the maximum amount you are prepared to pay to own the item, and if somebody else is prepared to pay more, well that's up to him.

You do not win at auction if you pay more for something than it is worth to you, and this is what can happen if you do not make an objective evaluation of the object long before any bids are lodged:- you just say "this is worth $X to me", leave your bid, and walk away.

ward · 5th March 2008, 12:48 AM

I think most of you had better get a slightly more realistic view on how much auctions cost. I have been buying from auctions since I was a child and selling on them when I hit 16. I have had customers in my computer bussiness who were auctioners and have a slightly more realistic view of what a bussiness cost to run. They have to be heavily advertised you have to hire people to run the auction,you have to store the items,you have to clean them,you have to research the item, pay rent, catalogs are what the public wants, you have dead beat buyers. All of this cost real money. Maybe the huge auction houses are making incredible profits but I know most smaller auction houses are not making the dollars you think. Regarding ebay sometimes you do well sometimes not. Yes the auction fees are less but the seller does all the work not the auction house.I have been selling on ebay for a long time and so has charles and a few others ask him how long it takes to set up a auction.
I agree you should come to a auction with a set price of what you are going to pay for a item, but I do that whenever I buy antiques

3rd March 2008, 10:13 PM	#1
Lew (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: East Coast USA Posts: 3,191	Another bright idea from the big brains at Ebay Just got email today In recent weeks fraudulent email offers targeting listings under $200 has surged unacceptably. To keep eBay a top shopping destination we must choose safety over visibility and nip this in the bud. We recognize for some of you this may be an unwelcome limitation but we hope you'll support our putting more muscle into fraud prevention. I called them up and gave them a piece of my mind. I had the customer rep laughing told him I was out bid on a pair of socks the sold for $1.29 and received a second chance email that I can buy it for .99 cents He agreed that he thinks it's a silly idea but he does not make up their policy Lew

4th March 2008, 01:49 AM	#8
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Predatory Practices Totally agree with you Barry . A Seller would do better in our Swap forum . So would a Buyer .

3rd March 2008, 10:40 PM	#2
spiral Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,712	Soryy Louie I dont understand from your post what have ebay actualy done? Have they banned all second chance offers? if so Is this US only or worlwide? or am i misunderstanding? Cheers, Spiral

3rd March 2008, 11:17 PM	#4
ward Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 637	Why not they raised selling fees 40% and made it so sellers can not leave negative feedback. It is getting very difficult to do business on ebay. Some of their other changes are just as obnoxious.

3rd March 2008, 11:30 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Ebay seems to have lost 'its way'...from its humble beginnings where trust was paramount ...it has grown in a massive marketing machine with new policies that seem to benefit eBay's bank balance. The real shame is that there isn't another 'big' auction site that could rival eBay. Then buyers and sellers could decide which internet auction site to use... so if people feel new policies were unfair etc they would use the 'other' site....people power. Unfortunately eBay is almost a monopoly driven by business exec's whom are looking to increase their profits to the detrement of the 'original values' of eBay. I feel it is becoming riskier to both buy and sell on eBay, hiding ID's will increase that risk ........

3rd March 2008, 11:47 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	I think things there have gotten to the point where astute Sellers and Buyers will take a seriously long look at further participation on their venue . I would like to see more Dealers open their own websites . Speaking for myself I would much rather buy directly from someone I can trust .

3rd March 2008, 11:52 PM	#7
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	PERHAPS EBAY IS INFECTED WITH THE SAME FORM OF GREED THAT MANY OTHER AUCTIONS SEEM TO BE ATE UP WITH THESE DAYS. I SUSPECT IT IS NOT UNUSUAL FOR A AUCTION TO CHARGE THE SELLER 20%OR MORE OF THE SALE PRICE AND PERHAPS A FEE FOR LISTING AND ACCEPTING THE ITEM NOT BEING A SELLER I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE CHARGES ARE. BUT BUYERS ARE CHARGED A 18 TO 20.5% BUYERS PREMIUM FOR THE PRIVILEGE OF BEING ALLOWED TO BUY SOMETHING FROM THE AUCTION. QUITE A PROFIT FOR VERY LITTLE WORK AS FAR AS THE BUYERS AND IF THEY TAKE A LARGER BITE FROM THE SELLER (WHO THEY DO SOME ACTUAL WORK FOR) THEN YOU ARE LOOKING AT A POSSIBLE PROFIT FOR THE AUCTION HOUSE OF 4O TO 50% PERHAPS MORE. WHEN YOU ADD THE PACKING, SHIPPING ECT WHICH AN INCREASING NUMBER OF ONLINE AUCTIONS LEAVE ENTIRELY UP TO THE BUYER TO ARRANGE WITH NO HELP FROM THEM AS WELL AS A STORAGE CHARGE IF YOUR MERCHANDISE IS NOT PICKED UP IN A SHORT TIME. IT WOULD APPEAR SOME AUCTIONS EXPECT THE SELLERS TO BE HAPPY WITH ABOUT THE SAME RETURN THEY WOULD GET TAKING THEIR ITEMS TO A PAWN SHOP. PENNYS ON THE DOLLAR FOR THE SELLER AND BIG PROFITS FOR THE AUCTION. A SELLER WILL SEE A HIGHER SALE PRICE ON EBAY OR SOUTHBYS OR CHRISTIES BUT IF MOST OF THE REALIZED PRICE GOES TO THE AUCTION AND YOU END UP WITH WHAT YOU WOULD GET LOCALLY WHY BOTHER WITH THE AUCTION HOUSE? I HAVE NEVER BOUGHT OR SOLD FROM SOUTHBYS OR CHRISTIES OR SOLD ON EBAY SO DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR CHARGES ARE BUT JUDGING FROM BUYERS PREMIUMS BEING SO HIGH I EXPECT THEM TO ALSO BE HIGH. THE NEXT THING WE KNOW EBAY WILL HAVE A BUYERS PREMIUM AS WELL AS APPROVED SHILL BIDDING.

4th March 2008, 11:39 PM	#11
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,892	Lee, I have dealt mainly with one Sydney auction house since I was in high school. Up until perhaps 25 years ago, this organisation charged the seller a 10% commission. There was no buyer's commission, the operation was plain, simple, no fancy catalogues, no up-market auction rooms. In a word:- basic. Then they started to get delusions of grandeur, moved out of their dark dusty auction rooms on the edge of Chinatown into a historic building on the edge of the corporate heart of town. Polished floors, elegant lighting, auctioneers in suits and ties.Very beautifully produced catalogues on art paper.Big advertisements in Saturday's newspapers. Seller's commissions rose, then buyer's commissions were introduced, and over the years it has just got worse. Currently, I think, the seller pays 25%, the buyer pays 22.5%. I still buy from them. I've never stopped. But I only ever pay what an item is worth to me. I recently bought an antique Chinese day bed. I knew a new one would cost me about $1500. I would have rather had a new one, than an antique one, so to me, this day bed was worth around $600-700. I lodged a bid of $550 ($550 + 22.5% = $673) with the auctioneer and went home. When I rang back I found I had won the day bed at $450. $450 + 22.5% = $551.Well inside my budget. What I have found is that all regular buyers at auction adjust their bid downwards to cover the buyer's commission. The only people who do not do this are the occasional buyers who have little or no experience, or who do not have an understanding of the value of something before they start to bid. I do understand the way in which sniping works on ebay, however, I feel that if you know the value of something, and you are prepared to pay a fair price, then sniping is not necessary. You simply lodge your maximum bid with ebay, and if nobody has placed a higher value on the item, you will win, and ebay will apply sufficient of your maximum bid to allow you to win, even after the auction closes.The whole philosophy of winning at auction is to know the value to you of the item being auctioned, and be prepared to pay that price to buy it. It could well be worth more to somebody else, but that should not concern you:- you have named the maximum amount you are prepared to pay to own the item, and if somebody else is prepared to pay more, well that's up to him. You do not win at auction if you pay more for something than it is worth to you, and this is what can happen if you do not make an objective evaluation of the object long before any bids are lodged:- you just say "this is worth $X to me", leave your bid, and walk away.

5th March 2008, 12:48 AM	#12
ward Member Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 637	I think most of you had better get a slightly more realistic view on how much auctions cost. I have been buying from auctions since I was a child and selling on them when I hit 16. I have had customers in my computer bussiness who were auctioners and have a slightly more realistic view of what a bussiness cost to run. They have to be heavily advertised you have to hire people to run the auction,you have to store the items,you have to clean them,you have to research the item, pay rent, catalogs are what the public wants, you have dead beat buyers. All of this cost real money. Maybe the huge auction houses are making incredible profits but I know most smaller auction houses are not making the dollars you think. Regarding ebay sometimes you do well sometimes not. Yes the auction fees are less but the seller does all the work not the auction house.I have been selling on ebay for a long time and so has charles and a few others ask him how long it takes to set up a auction. I agree you should come to a auction with a set price of what you are going to pay for a item, but I do that whenever I buy antiques