African ceremonial axe......comments?

katana · 27th August 2006, 10:18 PM

Just finished on eBay ...this IMHO interesting ceremonial axe.....Where is it from?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1

I've enhanced the picture.....seems to portray a snake....West African?

Flavio · 27th August 2006, 10:39 PM

It's a récade a symbol of regal authority in Dahomey (West africa).

katana · 27th August 2006, 11:19 PM

Thanks Flavio..

...was it a fair price?......is it a typical example?

Rather · 28th August 2006, 09:47 AM

Hi Katana,

I found this link in an older thread, it gives a lot of informaton about the Récardes.
http://www.epa-prema.net/abomey/pedago/recades.htm

A very beautiful example!

katana · 28th August 2006, 12:39 PM

Thanks for the info. Rather

....I did bid on this... I just had that 'feeling' that this was a 'good' item. But not knowing it's worth .... I bid too low....
nevermind

The Double D · 28th August 2006, 06:03 PM

I don't see a snake, I see an elephant. Does that mean anything? I don't know, I just see an elephant!

Tim Simmons · 28th August 2006, 06:22 PM

You may have something there. There was a special group of Palace Amazons that hunted elephants called the Gbeto. Apparently although not actually proven the king owned one of the tusks of every elephant taken with the option to take the rest on payment of compensation. When one thinks of the the royal set up of Amazons and Dahomey life, perhaps it may be an elephant and also a snake at the same time. I can see the eye of the elephant and the trunk. The trunk could transform into a snake. Observances of Dahomey art and society are not the most reliable and badly recorded and the system then lost after the French conquest so speculation may still have value.

katana · 28th August 2006, 07:26 PM

The photo is not too clear but ...the end of the 'trunk' appears to have the top view of a snake's head. The 'coil' seemed to me, to be a representation of a 'snake at rest'. The head of the shaft seemed snake-like with the 'trunk' being its tongue.....however I did think the eye doesn't have a reptilian look..
there is no charactristic 'slit-like' pupil..... but I have since discovered , not all snakes have this attribute.(see photos of indigenious snakes fro W. Africa)
The main concern regarding elephants is that there are IMHO 3 main characteristics regarding their heads, trunk, tusks and large ears... I see no representation of the ears.....but...

I found this which is VERY INTERESTING......

African serpents were often referred to as "Elephant's face", Master of the Forest, or Mombo-wa-Ndlopfu. These serpents were credited with speech and though they had bad breath, weren't necessarily evil. Often associated with the flesh-eating maggots of corpses, ancestral spirits and ghosts favoured their form as a disguise (Ananikian & Werner, 1925). The African dragon-serpent has a long-standing enmity with the elephant; the 30 ft long dragon-serpents, known only as "Elephant killers" often hunt elephants, sometimes lying in wait in pairs and tripping their prey with knotted tails (Byrne [ed], 1979). During creation, when the God of the Masai came to the world, he met a Dorobo tribal member, an elephant and a serpent. Therefore, the serpent and elephant share a special level of creation, which perhaps partially explains the serpent's animosity for its fellow beast (Ananikian & Werner, 1925).

This is also very relavent.....

Chameleons are widely regarded with unreasoning fear, especially in West Africa, where various beliefs associate the reptile with the Sun. In Dahomey, the chameleons are said to fetch fire from the Sun.

I've posted a photo of a Chameleon......notice the spirally curled tail.....

A little about snake worship....

http://www.sacred-texts.com/afr/vao/vao03.htm

Tim Simmons · 28th August 2006, 07:50 PM

One also has to take into consideration that serpents are the link to godhead. Divine rule is not exclusively Dahomeyian.

Battara · 28th August 2006, 08:16 PM

Also among many African peoples (and Indian too) the elephant was the true king of the jungle, not the lion, and was a symbol of royalty and divine favor.

Rather · 28th August 2006, 09:15 PM

It might be that the recarde just has by coincidence ornaments, which brings to our mind the resemblance to certain animals. I can not help, the one from my collation looks like a duck to me. Not in earnest the king of the jungle….

katana · 29th August 2006, 12:34 AM

All hail king Donald...........duck

Rather, I still see a snake, the tongue shaped as an axe blade.

I done some checking on the symbolism of the spiral....

The spiral is one of the oldest pagan symbols in existence. It represents the perpetual motion of life, with the spring-like coils suggesting latent power, presenting a picture of life as an endless, evolutionary process bound within the cycles of time. Although each loop of the spiral brings us back to the same place, it takes us to a higher and more evolved level.

Tim Simmons · 29th August 2006, 07:28 AM

The images on these are traditionally specific to a certain Kings rule. Thier "Bacio" a kind of protective totem. The last king Behanzin was a fish or a fish man and the king before Glele was a lion or lion man. Some may just carry general royal symbols to show the owners place in royal service.

Tim Simmons · 1st September 2006, 09:42 PM

Just added this for extra effect. Approx 10cm long. Could come from many parts of Africa but it has a look about it.

27th August 2006, 10:18 PM	#1
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	African ceremonial axe......comments? Just finished on eBay ...this IMHO interesting ceremonial axe.....Where is it from? http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1 I've enhanced the picture.....seems to portray a snake....West African? Attached Images

28th August 2006, 07:26 PM	#8
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	The photo is not too clear but ...the end of the 'trunk' appears to have the top view of a snake's head. The 'coil' seemed to me, to be a representation of a 'snake at rest'. The head of the shaft seemed snake-like with the 'trunk' being its tongue.....however I did think the eye doesn't have a reptilian look.. there is no charactristic 'slit-like' pupil..... but I have since discovered , not all snakes have this attribute.(see photos of indigenious snakes fro W. Africa) The main concern regarding elephants is that there are IMHO 3 main characteristics regarding their heads, trunk, tusks and large ears... I see no representation of the ears.....but... I found this which is VERY INTERESTING...... African serpents were often referred to as "Elephant's face", Master of the Forest, or Mombo-wa-Ndlopfu. These serpents were credited with speech and though they had bad breath, weren't necessarily evil. Often associated with the flesh-eating maggots of corpses, ancestral spirits and ghosts favoured their form as a disguise (Ananikian & Werner, 1925). The African dragon-serpent has a long-standing enmity with the elephant; the 30 ft long dragon-serpents, known only as "Elephant killers" often hunt elephants, sometimes lying in wait in pairs and tripping their prey with knotted tails (Byrne [ed], 1979). During creation, when the God of the Masai came to the world, he met a Dorobo tribal member, an elephant and a serpent. Therefore, the serpent and elephant share a special level of creation, which perhaps partially explains the serpent's animosity for its fellow beast (Ananikian & Werner, 1925). This is also very relavent..... Chameleons are widely regarded with unreasoning fear, especially in West Africa, where various beliefs associate the reptile with the Sun. In Dahomey, the chameleons are said to fetch fire from the Sun. I've posted a photo of a Chameleon......notice the spirally curled tail..... A little about snake worship.... http://www.sacred-texts.com/afr/vao/vao03.htm Attached Images

28th August 2006, 09:15 PM	#11
Rather Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 72	It might be that the recarde just has by coincidence ornaments, which brings to our mind the resemblance to certain animals. I can not help, the one from my collation looks like a duck to me. Not in earnest the king of the jungle…. Attached Images

29th August 2006, 12:34 AM	#12
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	All hail king Donald...........duck Rather, I still see a snake, the tongue shaped as an axe blade. I done some checking on the symbolism of the spiral.... The spiral is one of the oldest pagan symbols in existence. It represents the perpetual motion of life, with the spring-like coils suggesting latent power, presenting a picture of life as an endless, evolutionary process bound within the cycles of time. Although each loop of the spiral brings us back to the same place, it takes us to a higher and more evolved level. Last edited by katana; 29th August 2006 at 12:50 AM.

1st September 2006, 09:42 PM	#14
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	Just added this for extra effect. Approx 10cm long. Could come from many parts of Africa but it has a look about it. Attached Images

27th August 2006, 10:39 PM	#2
Flavio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Italia Posts: 1,243	It's a récade a symbol of regal authority in Dahomey (West africa).

27th August 2006, 11:19 PM	#3
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Thanks Flavio.. ...was it a fair price?......is it a typical example?

28th August 2006, 09:47 AM	#4
Rather Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 72	Hi Katana, I found this link in an older thread, it gives a lot of informaton about the Récardes. http://www.epa-prema.net/abomey/pedago/recades.htm A very beautiful example!

28th August 2006, 12:39 PM	#5
katana Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Kent Posts: 2,653	Thanks for the info. Rather ....I did bid on this... I just had that 'feeling' that this was a 'good' item. But not knowing it's worth .... I bid too low.... nevermind

28th August 2006, 06:03 PM	#6
The Double D Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: On the banks of Cut Bank Creek, Montana Posts: 189	I don't see a snake, I see an elephant. Does that mean anything? I don't know, I just see an elephant!

28th August 2006, 06:22 PM	#7
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	You may have something there. There was a special group of Palace Amazons that hunted elephants called the Gbeto. Apparently although not actually proven the king owned one of the tusks of every elephant taken with the option to take the rest on payment of compensation. When one thinks of the the royal set up of Amazons and Dahomey life, perhaps it may be an elephant and also a snake at the same time. I can see the eye of the elephant and the trunk. The trunk could transform into a snake. Observances of Dahomey art and society are not the most reliable and badly recorded and the system then lost after the French conquest so speculation may still have value.

28th August 2006, 07:50 PM	#9
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	One also has to take into consideration that serpents are the link to godhead. Divine rule is not exclusively Dahomeyian.

28th August 2006, 08:16 PM	#10
Battara EAAF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 7,219	Also among many African peoples (and Indian too) the elephant was the true king of the jungle, not the lion, and was a symbol of royalty and divine favor.

29th August 2006, 07:28 AM	#13
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	The images on these are traditionally specific to a certain Kings rule. Thier "Bacio" a kind of protective totem. The last king Behanzin was a fish or a fish man and the king before Glele was a lion or lion man. Some may just carry general royal symbols to show the owners place in royal service.