My first kris :)

[migueldiaz]

Hi all,

Am new around here and am very new to collecting edged weapons for that matter.

So finally I bought this kris which kept appearing in my dreams ever since I saw its pics.

The hilt is gold-"plated" with repoussed okir design. Pommel is ivory and blade's laminated structure can be discerned.

Overall length is 630 mm [24.8"] and blade length is 512 mm [20.1"].

Attached are pics sent by the seller before I made the purchase.

Would appreciate any comments and observations ... even negative as I guess we are all here to learn.

Thanks in advance!

[apolaki]

WOW! that is soooooo beautiful. i wish i could find one of that nature 2 one day...

[migueldiaz]

Originally Posted by apolaki

WOW! that is soooooo beautiful. i wish i could find one of that nature 2 one day...

apolaki, thanks.

it's a joy to hold and to behold

to all forumites,

i have some questions, please.

in the subject kris, the lamination is there all right, but i'm sure it will not be apparent to the untrained eye. me being a novice, i have to look closely myself.

now i've seen in this forum pics of a lot of blades (barung, kris, etc.) with lamination that's very pronounced.

so my [newbie] question/s are:

[1] is the lamination in some blades more apparent because of some deliberate act? (e.g., polishing, or etching if that's the right term);

[2] is the value of a blade enhanced if such lamination features are made more apparent? or is this just a matter of personal preference and nothing more?

[3] what's the big deal on laminated blades in the first place? in the specific case of moro blades, if they are not laminated would that mean that the blades are fairly recent?

[4] how do you make the lamination come out -- would the procedure described by rick be the one, or was rick referring to a procedure for another context? rick, hope you can comment again!

i have dug up old posts and i can't find direct answers to the above. if they have been discussed in the past, can i just kindly request for the links then.

thanks again to all.

[apolaki]

I have a general question about lamination.. what does it mean?

The blade of my moro kris is very dull, its not sharp at all. i wonder if it was laminated? lol sorry, im very novice myself.. Thanks for enlightening me..

[kai]

Hello Miguel,

That's a long thread - here's the specfic post:
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showpo...5&postcount=16
There are more recipes to be found on this forum.

Yes, this procedure will bring out laminations (layers of steel which show how the steel got forged).

Depending on the blade's surface (if corroded), you may want to do a little polishing first before moving on to etching.

I'd also stipulate that there is no point in neutralizing diluted vinegar (I prefer technical grade acetic acid and am usually using 1% which is a weak solution): Just heating the blade (with a hair dryer, after wiping on some oil!) will evaporate all remaining acid; just make sure that no vinegar remains in any crevices (just heat those areas longer).

I'll come back to the other questions later.

Regards,
Kai

[migueldiaz]

Hello Kai,

Thanks for the reply!

Am looking forward to your (and the others') further comments.

Best regards,

MD

PS - So that's how you handpick a post, with the "postcount" suffix. Thanks for the tip

[kai]

Hello Miguel,

[1] is the lamination in some blades more apparent because of some deliberate act? (e.g., polishing, or etching if that's the right term);

Yes, that's usually enhanced by recent etching; there is some discussion wether Moro blades were etched by default traditionally: There are some assertions that blades were etched to keep a drawn blade from reflecting sun light and possibly warn the victim of an ambush. There also are reports that blades were polished shiny as a preparation of a juramentado. This isn't necessarily a contradiction though (practical vs. ritual).

[2] is the value of a blade enhanced if such lamination features are made more apparent? or is this just a matter of personal preference and nothing more?

Probably personal preference/curiosity as well as a matter of being historically correct. Special lamination patterns will also imply a higher status blade.

[3] what's the big deal on laminated blades in the first place? in the specific case of moro blades, if they are not laminated would that mean that the blades are fairly recent?

Laminated blades are usually not merely intended for show but business; cheap tourist blades are always done from monosteel (by forging or often mere stock removal). There are a few antique Moro kris with honest monosteel blades because European steel was of high quality and didn't needed the traditional welding procedure to produce high quality blades. OTOH, some keris sundang are currently produced in Indonesia with high-contrast pamor. However, the rule of thumb still is that laminated blades are old/antique.

Regards,
Kai

[migueldiaz]

Hello Kai and Bill,

Wow, you guys are awesome ... I am not worthy

Many thanks for those observations on the kris and answers to the queries! Reviewing the kris with those info in mind, it certainly gives me a new perspective and greater depth in appreciating the piece.

So if for any reason you sirs will be in Manila, don't hesitate to tell me in advance. I'll certainly treat you to the largest steak in town

I think I am definitely hooked into this new pursuit of mine.

Thanks again and I'll get those other info (on the coins, etc.). Will also do the etching soon (among other to-do's like trace Ramon Villegas).

MD

[Spunjer]

hi miguel

welcome, pare..
at the base of the handle, the brass looking thingy; it reminds me of the bagung lipunan singko centavo coin. or is it?

also, between the handle and the pommel, there appears to be a clear, milky substance. is just a reflection from the cam, or is it glue?
if you can remove the blade from the handle (with heat) you should be able to tell if the wood is fairly new or old.