Medieval dagger?

erlikhan · 17th January 2006, 11:16 PM

ebay no 7381700358. do you think it is original medieval item or repro?? Is it not too cheap if original, or you can find medieval daggers so often at any corner on Europe streets that its price is so low??

regards

Ian · 18th January 2006, 01:14 AM

Erlikhan:

Almost impossible to assess genuine medieval iron artefacts from such poor quality pictures. If you look at the other items on the same seller's list you will see two more knives in almost identical states of "decay." They almost appear to have come from the same source. What are the odds?

Our esteemed host, Dr Lee Jones, is an expert in antique weapons and he may be able to give you a better read on these knives. To me they are unconvincing examples of medieval cutlery, but I've been wrong before.

Ian.

ingelred · 18th January 2006, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ian

Erlikhan:

Almost impossible to assess genuine medieval iron artefacts from such poor quality pictures. If you look at the other items on the same seller's list you will see two more knives in almost identical states of "decay." They almost appear to have come from the same source. What are the odds?

Our esteemed host, Dr Lee Jones, is an expert in antique weapons and he may be able to give you a better read on these knives. To me they are unconvincing examples of medieval cutlery, but I've been wrong before.

Ian.

Hello,

I think this item is probably genuine. Concerning Ian's statement that all items on the seller's list are almost in the same of decay, in Germany there are a lot of people searching metal artifacts with detectors as a hobby. These people spend their spare time walking through the landscape with their metal detectors and scanning the terrain for old weapons and metal artifacts. Some of these people sell the found items, some of them collect them. You can find them also on flea markets in Germany. Of course this searching is not really legal.
Probably all these items are of this source.

Greetings, Helge

Andrew · 18th January 2006, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ingelred

Hello,

I think this item is probably genuine.

Hi Helge,

What is it about this particular item that leads you to opine it is genuine?

Andrew

ingelred · 18th January 2006, 06:16 PM

Hello Andrew,

what I mean was I think that the dagger is a real medieval item and not a repro.
What makes me think of that are all the other items offered by the seller.
Of course I can not prove the authenticity (who can just by looking at not so good pictures?).
What I think is that the seller offers items he found by searching the areas around old castles for medieval artifacts using metal detectors.
So found items are often sold on flea markets and through the internet.
That is what may happen here.
Just my guess, I may be wrong.

Greetings Helge

erlikhan · 18th January 2006, 09:45 PM

in my opinion, the corrosion looks natural for an exceptionally preserved old iron undersoil artifact. If it was introduced as a Roman or Celtic dagger, it would convince me more.But in 13-14th centuries, not iron but strong steel was used to make blades, not? and if so, they shouldnt need to cast iron daggers in completely one piece,from tip to pommel. Am I wrong?? In fact I dont have good knowledge about medieval European daggers and can be wrong,if so please correct me.
Plus, how can iron daggers, which are much weaker than bronze against undersoil effects be found intact and in very good condition by digging in numbers large enough to hold their prices in 100-200 dollars? In Turkey which has been a battleground for thousands of years ,many people dig everywhere but I havent met any definite and intact medieval daggers found by anyone,although they have been showing many interesting things from all periods starting from ancient times. Strange.

17th January 2006, 11:16 PM	#1
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	Medieval dagger? ebay no 7381700358. do you think it is original medieval item or repro?? Is it not too cheap if original, or you can find medieval daggers so often at any corner on Europe streets that its price is so low?? regards

18th January 2006, 01:14 AM	#2
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,200	Erlikhan: Almost impossible to assess genuine medieval iron artefacts from such poor quality pictures. If you look at the other items on the same seller's list you will see two more knives in almost identical states of "decay." They almost appear to have come from the same source. What are the odds? Our esteemed host, Dr Lee Jones, is an expert in antique weapons and he may be able to give you a better read on these knives. To me they are unconvincing examples of medieval cutlery, but I've been wrong before. Ian.

18th January 2006, 06:16 PM	#5
ingelred Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Moenchengladbach, Germany Posts: 62	Hello Andrew, what I mean was I think that the dagger is a real medieval item and not a repro. What makes me think of that are all the other items offered by the seller. Of course I can not prove the authenticity (who can just by looking at not so good pictures?). What I think is that the seller offers items he found by searching the areas around old castles for medieval artifacts using metal detectors. So found items are often sold on flea markets and through the internet. That is what may happen here. Just my guess, I may be wrong. Greetings Helge

18th January 2006, 09:45 PM	#6
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	in my opinion, the corrosion looks natural for an exceptionally preserved old iron undersoil artifact. If it was introduced as a Roman or Celtic dagger, it would convince me more.But in 13-14th centuries, not iron but strong steel was used to make blades, not? and if so, they shouldnt need to cast iron daggers in completely one piece,from tip to pommel. Am I wrong?? In fact I dont have good knowledge about medieval European daggers and can be wrong,if so please correct me. Plus, how can iron daggers, which are much weaker than bronze against undersoil effects be found intact and in very good condition by digging in numbers large enough to hold their prices in 100-200 dollars? In Turkey which has been a battleground for thousands of years ,many people dig everywhere but I havent met any definite and intact medieval daggers found by anyone,although they have been showing many interesting things from all periods starting from ancient times. Strange.