Oh well, I wasn't really in the market for another kris

[Marcus]

But an impulse bid on eBay won following:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Original-NAG...p2047675.l2557

Comments welcome.

[David]

Well Marcus, i could be wrong, but i suspect this is neither a Bali keris nor particularly old. I have brought some of the auction photos over since they will disappear off your link soon enough.

[Marcus]

Bringing the pictures over was I good idea. I don't feel too heavily invested in the item, I was probably drinking a nice Scotch when I hit the bid button and no one bid against me.
If not old and not Bali, I would still like opinions on when and where.

[Jean]

Madurese piece made in Balinese style IMO but the naga carving is very poor.
Regards

[Henk]

Marcus,

David and Jean are right. Although feedback on ebay is 100% possitive I know the seller hasn't an impeccable reputation here in the Netherlands and in Indonesia where he buys his merchandise.

[A. G. Maisey]

I have a distinct problem with this keris.

If we consider the component parts we have a wewer that is very definitely Balinese and from post 1960.

The sarung is a Balinese style, executed in what appears to be sono wood and I can see no indication at all that it is not of Balinese manufacture.

The danganan is a Balinese style, but of comparatively recent manufacture, it may be Balinese, it may be a Madurese or Javanese copy, from the photo I cannot tell.

The blade is a real puzzle. It is most definitely not a Balinese style, nor does the material have the characteristics of a Balinese blade, the finish of the surface is not typically Balinese, the manner in which the material has been welded is not typically Balinese, the pawakan is not typically Balinese, the carving at the gandhik is not typically Balinese.

What makes this problem more difficult still is that nothing about this blade is typical of Madura blades made after 1980.

Nor does it give the impression of Javanese workmanship.

I believe we can confidently eliminate all other keris bearing societies as a possible source, with one exception: Lombok.

Lombok is well known for some very peculiar keris, and this one is indeed very peculiar.

I am not saying that this keris is Lombok, but I do think that Lombok is a more likely place of origin than any other.

[asomotif]

Originally Posted by Marcus

If not old and not Bali, I would still like opinions on when and where.

To be honest, I don't put much effort in learning names, but during the last 20 years I have handled a substantial number of old and new keris.

The keris you bought is offered as : a very good forged Blade done by a very good Empu
and as : a nice item from the old days of Indonesia.

Well, these are a few characteristics that do not come to my mind when I see this keris. I would suggest to return the item, and get a nice bottle of 20 year old scotch whisky

Best regards,
Willem

[Sajen]

Originally Posted by asomotif

Well, these are a few characteristics that do not come to my mind when I see this keris. I would suggest to return the item, and get a nice bottle of 20 year old scotch whisky

Hello Marcus,

agree here with Willem, sorry!

Regards,
Detlef

[mross]

Originally Posted by Marcus

Bringing the pictures over was I good idea. I don't feel too heavily invested in the item, I was probably drinking a nice Scotch when I hit the bid button and no one bid against me.
If not old and not Bali, I would still like opinions on when and where.

Sigh, I know the feeling very well. Kentucky Bourbon for me though.

[satrionumpaknogo]

Madura ..

The garap of the dragon is so so n slightly of from pakem. You can also identified from the shape of dha at greneng it is soooo Madura

My advice keep ur money mate..Im not saying Madura Kris bad but Madura after Mataram era is slighly degrading on its quality n garap just like Madiun..sad really

If you look for Madura then look for Sumenep Dalem

Cheers

[Marcus]

As much as I appreciate the suggestions to go for another nice bottle of Scotch over this kris (I'm not a fan of bourbon), I am not the sort of person who would reverse a deal based on third party advice given after the fact. I received the kris yesterday. The pictures are accurate, even though the description/attribution may not be correct. I don't think my own pictures would add much.

My understanding is that it is not really legitimate to refer to this as a "Naga kris" based on the crude quality of the carving, the fact that it is restricted to the outside surface of the dagu, and of course that the blade is straight not wavy. Also, I understand that the scabbard is not typical of Bali. Is it Madurese or possibly from Lombok?

Clearly, I am not a kris specialist so I could also use help with some of the terminology, specifically Mr. Maisey's statement "Marcus' wrongko is almost certainly sono".

Marcus

[Jean]

Originally Posted by satrionumpaknogo

Madura ..

The garap of the dragon is so so n slightly of from pakem. You can also identified from the shape of dha at greneng it is soooo Madura

My advice keep ur money mate..Im not saying Madura Kris bad but Madura after Mataram era is slighly degrading on its quality n garap just like Madiun..sad really

If you look for Madura then look for Sumenep Dalem

Cheers

Hello Satrio,
Thanks for your input and please continue to participate in this forum, we need more Indonesian members to mitigate the Westerners' opinions
If you have a good specimen of genuine Sumenep Dalem blade, please show it to us for reference.
Regards