Ethnographic Arms & Armour
 

Go Back   Ethnographic Arms & Armour > Discussion Forums > Ethnographic Weapons
FAQ Calendar Today's Posts Search

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 24th February 2006, 04:11 AM   #1
ariel
Member
 
ariel's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 5,503
Default "The sword of the Prophet"

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...MEWA%3AIT&rd=1
A lot of money for a Wilkinson's fantasy sword!
Most interesting, despite all the fuss about "extensive research", this is as far from a genuine early Arabian sword as it can get.
The handle is very " Moresque" , ie early 2nd milennium North African/Andalusian variety.
ariel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2006, 04:33 AM   #2
Alan62
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 164
Default

I have a kinjal with some script on it,I posted a picture of the script on a translator forum and this is what the translation said(according to the translator)

"The sentence says: "la fata ella Ali (the first line), la sayf ella dhol-feqar".
Its mean is: "No boy except 'Ali', no sword except 'dhol-feqar'".
If you want explanation of it, here it is:

'Ali' is the name of 'Al-Imam Ali ibn Abi Talib (Karraml-lahu wajhahw)'.
He is the cousin of the Prophet Muhammad (3alayhis-sallam).

'dhol-feqar' is the name of Imam Ali's sword.

This sentence is said by Shi'a Muslims. "


I thought it was interesting (funny thing I just found out about an hour ago after months of searching)

Here is the Kinjal with the script

Alan62 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2006, 05:50 AM   #3
ham
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 190
Default 786

I think a little context is called for here:

The nearest English sense for the Arabic is

There is no hero like 'Ali
and no sword like Dhul-Faqar

'Ali was a near relative of the Prophet by both blood and marriage.
He was chosen 4th Caliph, or successor to the Prophet, as ruler of Muslims.
But the reason this passage appears so often on Islamic weapons is that 'Ali was known as the greatest Muslim warrior. He is revered for his strength and honor by all Muslims, and the saying is certainly not limited to Shi'a followers alone.
The matter of the cloven tip of this most famous sword, given by the Prophet to 'Ali, has been discussed ad infinitum on this forum over the years. What may not have been addressed however, is the meaning of its name, Dhul Faqar. This has nothing to do with the tip of the blade, rather it means Posessor of Spines. Given the form of most early Arab blades (visible at Topkapi and elsewhere,) this name appears to refer to the central fullering and/or raised ribs visible on many of them.

Sincerely,

Ham
ham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2006, 01:51 PM   #4
Alan62
Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 164
Default

Thanks for clearing that up ham,

Ariel I agree with you it seems like a lot of money for a "fantasy" sword,
I wonder if other fantasy sword that are limited editions go for that much?

I like my old beat up Kindjal better
Alan62 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2006, 08:25 PM   #5
Pusaka
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 341
Default

I remember seeing a ancient painting of the sword and it was shown as a curved blade with the snake tong point (forked)
Pusaka is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24th February 2006, 11:18 PM   #6
Dom
Member
 
Dom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Paris (FR*) Cairo (EG)
Posts: 1,142
Default

In Topkapi Palace, I saw a sample for that type of sword,
in Tunis souk also, it was a copy, funny
here joined, a scan from my bibliotheque source;
- Les Armes Orientales (Easten Weapons) by Iaroslav Lebedynsky
http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/attach...tid=8831&stc=1

translation of French text:
Zulficar (dhoû-l-faqâr) ottaman
of XVIII century with flamed
blades. Zulficar is a blade parallels
scimitar evoking the legendary sabre of Ali.
The use of such weapons to the combat is doubtful;
some could be used as religious or military emblems.

à +

Dom
Attached Images
 
Dom is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 04:43 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.