Dagger for ID ... and comments

fernando · 13th December 2019, 05:23 PM

Half way to a stiletto, may i say ...
Acquired in Portugal, traced as from a mannor house. A friar once lived there; could he have brought from distant places ?
... Or is it actually Portuguese ?
The blade with an atypical cross section; flat in the 'bottom' face, plain in one half ridged face and concave on the other half.
The sccabard, i am not sure if it was born for it.
Total length 28 cms. Weight 375 grams.
Whay do you guys make of this piece ?
Thnks in advance.

.

kronckew · 13th December 2019, 07:18 PM

Cool stylette, look a bit italian/mediterranean, bit rough corrosion, may hide markings. the brass wrap on the base of the blade is interesting. It's interesting what gets found in old attics. (see my other post of today I am posting in a few minutes.)

Richard G · 13th December 2019, 10:49 PM

I wouldn't be surprised if it was Western Saharan or close. it doesn,t seem that far from one of those Tuareg, Mauratanian, Senegalese daggers.
Regards
Richard

fernando · 14th December 2019, 12:06 PM

Thank you for your comments, guys.
Richard, i can see your point; some details ... yes but, some other ... i wonder.
Let us copy this thread to the Etnho forum, to see what the members there would have to say.

ariel · 14th December 2019, 03:39 PM

I cannot find anything to implicate N.African Islamic tradition here. The triangular blade is perhaps the strongest argument in favor of a European one. A Misericord, perhaps, or just a stiletto?

fernando · 14th December 2019, 06:39 PM

Thank you Ariel.
So i made the correct start, first posting it the Euro forum.

Kubur · 14th December 2019, 06:58 PM

Yes
European and it's the other round for African daggers. Cabo Verde and Senegalese knives have been influenced by Spanish and Portuguese knives...

Question: your dagger looks quiete old, is it something from 17th or 18th c.?

fernando · 14th December 2019, 07:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kubur

... Question: your dagger looks quiete old, is it something from 17th or 18th c.?

Who can tell ... 18th the oldest ... maybe.
Given yours and Ariel's opinions here and also the conviction of the person i got if from, i will have it defined as European and will merge both threads over there.

M ELEY · 15th December 2019, 01:49 AM

I always have to toss in the possibility of Spanish colonial. The 'swollen' grips and ball quillon points like yours often seen on colonial Southwestern items ranging down into central Mexico (New Spain).
The grip also reminds me of those Canary Island dirks as well...

13th December 2019, 05:23 PM	#1
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Dagger for ID ... and comments Half way to a stiletto, may i say ... Acquired in Portugal, traced as from a mannor house. A friar once lived there; could he have brought from distant places ? ... Or is it actually Portuguese ? The blade with an atypical cross section; flat in the 'bottom' face, plain in one half ridged face and concave on the other half. The sccabard, i am not sure if it was born for it. Total length 28 cms. Weight 375 grams. Whay do you guys make of this piece ? Thnks in advance. . Attached Images

15th December 2019, 01:49 AM	#9
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,097	I always have to toss in the possibility of Spanish colonial. The 'swollen' grips and ball quillon points like yours often seen on colonial Southwestern items ranging down into central Mexico (New Spain). The grip also reminds me of those Canary Island dirks as well... Last edited by M ELEY; 15th December 2019 at 01:50 AM. Reason: edit

13th December 2019, 07:18 PM	#2
kronckew Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Room 101, Glos. UK Posts: 4,183	Cool stylette, look a bit italian/mediterranean, bit rough corrosion, may hide markings. the brass wrap on the base of the blade is interesting. It's interesting what gets found in old attics. (see my other post of today I am posting in a few minutes.)

13th December 2019, 10:49 PM	#3
Richard G Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 406	I wouldn't be surprised if it was Western Saharan or close. it doesn,t seem that far from one of those Tuareg, Mauratanian, Senegalese daggers. Regards Richard

14th December 2019, 12:06 PM	#4
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Thank you for your comments, guys. Richard, i can see your point; some details ... yes but, some other ... i wonder. Let us copy this thread to the Etnho forum, to see what the members there would have to say.

14th December 2019, 03:39 PM	#5
ariel Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Ann Arbor, MI Posts: 5,503	I cannot find anything to implicate N.African Islamic tradition here. The triangular blade is perhaps the strongest argument in favor of a European one. A Misericord, perhaps, or just a stiletto?

14th December 2019, 06:39 PM	#6
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	Thank you Ariel. So i made the correct start, first posting it the Euro forum.

14th December 2019, 06:58 PM	#7
Kubur Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 2,145	Yes European and it's the other round for African daggers. Cabo Verde and Senegalese knives have been influenced by Spanish and Portuguese knives... Question: your dagger looks quiete old, is it something from 17th or 18th c.?