Resin, traditional recipies

Gavin Nugent · 18th March 2011, 06:35 AM

There has been a lot of questions over the years about original resins in relation to weapons manufacture.

I am looking for a little direction with traditional Turkic resin solutions used in sword manufacture for securing grip slabs, grip straps, guards and no doubt holding scabbard leathers and suspension fittings in place.

Whilst I am looking further in to the Turkic regions and asking for a little help I think it would also be well placed if the thread developed in to an entire region specific method of creating native resins for weapons not modern epoxy componds.
It is bound to differ greatly from country to counry, region to region and would be well worth seeing the any diferences in say a Nepalese Kukri and Burmese Dha or a Turkish Kilij and a Mandau from Borneo etc.

I am sure many could benefit from this knowledge being shared in one thread for easy reference..

I look forward to reading about this from those better versed on the subject.

Gav

Tim Simmons · 18th March 2011, 11:57 AM

Gav, they very probably along with resins used "animal glue" I can still remember a rock hard pot of it in the school metalwork department. This would be better than many resins.

Gavin Nugent · 18th March 2011, 12:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

Gav, they very probably along with resins used "animal glue" I can still remember a rock hard pot of it in the school metalwork department. This would be better than many resins.

A great start thanks Tim, I'll have a look down that road.

I look forward to seeing traditional recipies of any relevant form now that you have bought this to my attention.

thanks

Gav

Neil · 18th March 2011, 04:21 PM

Hopefully this tidbit is of some interest. I have heard of fish glue being used to fasten Chinese spear heads to their shafts. Unfortunately I do not have a recipe or literary source to site. No doubt, one idea often leads to another though so I thought it was worth mentioning.

tom hyle · 18th March 2011, 10:46 PM

fish-bone/hide/hoof glue is more brittle than boiled down tree sap (pitch/resin); thus it is a good ad-hesive, but a poor co-hesive for filling large gaps, setting tangs, etc. Also, I think it remains water-soluble? Thus it is not traditionally used by professional cutlers for this pupose AFAIK although my experience of Chinese spears specifically is slight. Never seen it on a sword except as a non-professional after-market repair.
I am very interested to read about pitch/resin; tree species, thickening and application techniques, etc.

t_c · 18th March 2011, 10:46 PM

Great thought Gav - an official glue thread!
I'll try to make a humble contribution in regards to a Japanese "rice glue". If I remember the process correctly, one would grind down rice to a fine powder (mortar and pedestal) and then add water to make a paste. Apply the paste, let dry, and you had a semi-decent glue. I haven't tried this myself, but a friend had some mixed results with it though. Maybe someone else has better information on rice glue process.

I'd be interested in anyone's experience with making ( or information regarding) the black pitch that is found in PI and Indonesian weapons. What is that stuff?

tom

Rust Collector · 18th March 2011, 11:23 PM

There is mastic, the resin of Pistacia Lentisicus, it grows throughout the mediterranean I know it was in wide use across moughal India attaching tulwar blades to hilts. I don't remember anything about the turks using it.

asomotif · 18th March 2011, 11:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t_c

I'd be interested in anyone's experience with making ( or information regarding) the black pitch that is found in PI and Indonesian weapons. What is that stuff?

tom

It it a mixture based on damar.
Here is a thread giving some details
: http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showth...ighlight=damar

You can buy damar maybe in specialised paint stores. (as in paint used for paintings)
But when you buy it from such a store it is than very clean and not black / dark at all.

Best regards,
Willem

18th March 2011, 06:35 AM	#1
Gavin Nugent Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 2,818	Resin, traditional recipies There has been a lot of questions over the years about original resins in relation to weapons manufacture. I am looking for a little direction with traditional Turkic resin solutions used in sword manufacture for securing grip slabs, grip straps, guards and no doubt holding scabbard leathers and suspension fittings in place. Whilst I am looking further in to the Turkic regions and asking for a little help I think it would also be well placed if the thread developed in to an entire region specific method of creating native resins for weapons not modern epoxy componds. It is bound to differ greatly from country to counry, region to region and would be well worth seeing the any diferences in say a Nepalese Kukri and Burmese Dha or a Turkish Kilij and a Mandau from Borneo etc. I am sure many could benefit from this knowledge being shared in one thread for easy reference.. I look forward to reading about this from those better versed on the subject. Gav Last edited by freebooter; 18th March 2011 at 09:49 AM. Reason: Additions

18th March 2011, 11:57 AM	#2
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,806	Gav, they very probably along with resins used "animal glue" I can still remember a rock hard pot of it in the school metalwork department. This would be better than many resins.

18th March 2011, 04:21 PM	#4
Neil Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 109	Hopefully this tidbit is of some interest. I have heard of fish glue being used to fasten Chinese spear heads to their shafts. Unfortunately I do not have a recipe or literary source to site. No doubt, one idea often leads to another though so I thought it was worth mentioning.

18th March 2011, 10:46 PM	#5
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	fish-bone/hide/hoof glue is more brittle than boiled down tree sap (pitch/resin); thus it is a good ad-hesive, but a poor co-hesive for filling large gaps, setting tangs, etc. Also, I think it remains water-soluble? Thus it is not traditionally used by professional cutlers for this pupose AFAIK although my experience of Chinese spears specifically is slight. Never seen it on a sword except as a non-professional after-market repair. I am very interested to read about pitch/resin; tree species, thickening and application techniques, etc.

18th March 2011, 10:46 PM	#6
t_c Member Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: ca, usa Posts: 92	Great thought Gav - an official glue thread! I'll try to make a humble contribution in regards to a Japanese "rice glue". If I remember the process correctly, one would grind down rice to a fine powder (mortar and pedestal) and then add water to make a paste. Apply the paste, let dry, and you had a semi-decent glue. I haven't tried this myself, but a friend had some mixed results with it though. Maybe someone else has better information on rice glue process. I'd be interested in anyone's experience with making ( or information regarding) the black pitch that is found in PI and Indonesian weapons. What is that stuff? tom

18th March 2011, 11:23 PM	#7
Rust Collector Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 11	There is mastic, the resin of Pistacia Lentisicus, it grows throughout the mediterranean I know it was in wide use across moughal India attaching tulwar blades to hilts. I don't remember anything about the turks using it.