IRISH POLICE BILLY CLUB NIGHTSTICK ,CA 1900

BANDOOK · 5th May 2017, 01:13 PM

Just Added To My Collection From Early 1900s Is This Irish Police Club made of heavy Dark Wood.
Carved With Shamrocks,Celtic Harp,A Hound Dog,and has a Leather Wrist Thong
LENGTH 14 "
HAS ANY MEMBER HAVE THESE IN YOUR COLLECTION PLEASE POST EXAMPLES,REGARDS RAJESH

Kmaddock · 5th May 2017, 02:25 PM

Hi
It is made from Bog Oak, this is Oak which fell into a bog around 10,000 years ago and buried in a few meters of bog
The oak turns into this extremely heavy dense black wood.
Yew and pines also are found and they go a more red golden colour.
This wood is v v tough and difficult to work with as it is impregnated with silt and sand.

These batons come up fairly regularly at auctions here in Ireland identified as many different things.

Generally quiet short for a batton and the use i believe they are for is a batton killing fish sometimes called a "Priest".

Google" bog oak sculpture" and you will see lots of carvings and a more detailed explanation of the formation of bog oak.

I did sculpture years ago and this material blunted chisels in minutes.

Regards and nice item by the way

Ken

thinreadline · 5th May 2017, 03:25 PM

very nice . I do agree with Ken , these are normally classed as 'priests' for dispatching salmon .

BANDOOK · 6th May 2017, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thinreadline

very nice . I do agree with Ken , these are normally classed as 'priests' for dispatching salmon .

Thanks Thinreadline

Lee · 27th March 2023, 06:26 PM

I must have missed this informative and helpful thread when it was fresh and I discovered it only when doing a Google search after acquiring an example at a New York State rural auction a few days ago. I had presumed it must have been for the tourist, owing to the depiction of Blarney Castle but I liked the theme including the stone tower and the high relief carved shamrocks.

The material was a mystery to me until I read Ken's comments - thank you! This example is 15 1/8 inches in length and weighs 17.7 ounces.

Somehow I suspect that a 'priest' is nominally to a fish dispatching tool exactly as a 'shillelagh' is to a walking stick.

BANDOOK · 6th May 2017, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kmaddock

Hi
It is made from Bog Oak, this is Oak which fell into a bog around 10,000 years ago and buried in a few meters of bog
The oak turns into this extremely heavy dense black wood.
Yew and pines also are found and they go a more red golden colour.
This wood is v v tough and difficult to work with as it is impregnated with silt and sand.

These batons come up fairly regularly at auctions here in Ireland identified as many different things.

Generally quiet short for a batton and the use i believe they are for is a batton killing fish sometimes called a "Priest".

Google" bog oak sculpture" and you will see lots of carvings and a more detailed explanation of the formation of bog oak.

I did sculpture years ago and this material blunted chisels in minutes.

Regards and nice item by the way

Ken

Thanks Ken,great information appreciate that,Regards Rajesh

Norman McCormick · 28th March 2023, 09:02 PM

Hi,
I have one of these, got it with other bits and pieces in a sale. It is 12 1/2 inches long and 11.1 ozs. As an occasional fresh and sea water fisherman I can well imagine it would do the job of a fisherman's priest very well but I get the feeling that these are more of a souvenir than anything else. They all seem to have the same basic adornment i.e. shamrocks, Irish Celtic harp motifs and crosshatching. They are nicely produced items and I wouldn't like to be on the receiving end of one but I am not convinced that they are anything other than a well crafted item for those who travel.
Regards,
Norman

MacCathain · 29th March 2023, 12:49 AM

A friend gave me this example of the breed about 10 years ago. It's a bit more interesting than the typical priest as it is named to its original owner, and is 71.6cm/28.2" in length. As such, it is too short for a walking stick, but too long and heavy for whacking salmon. It is, however, the ideal size for a military officer's swagger stick, albeit a beefy one.

It was originally the property of Jeffrey Hale Burland, who was a noted Montreal businessman, philanthropist and Lt.-Col. of the 6th Battalion of Infantry, Canadian Militia. His name and rank are engraved on the brass cap that adorns the head of the stick. The cap is 38mm/1.5" in length and 25.4mm/1" in diameter, and is soldered to the face of a brass uniform button of the 6th Battalion. I would bet that the wood underneath the cap is cross-hatched in the same way as the priests posted above. The other end of the stick shows where a small brass ferrule was once fitted.

The stick is well-carved with the same shamrocks, vines and leaves as shown in the posts above. The carving includes an Irish harp in relief, over which is mounted a brass Victorian crown that appears to have been repurposed from a military badge. On the side opposite of the harp is a relief carving of a dog in repose. With a square muzzle and erect ears, it looks like it represents a Great Dane, but I'm certain it's intended as a generic depiction.

Burland was commissioned in the 6th Battalion of Infantry in 1882. Ten years later, he commanded the regiment. Given that the rank of Lt.-Col. precedes his name on the stick's brass cap, I would surmise that the stick itself was made between 1892 and 1898, when Burland held that rank and before the 6th was amalgamated with the 1st Battalion Prince of Wales Regiment to form the Prince of Wales' Regiment Fusiliers. I'd guess the stick was acquired in its base form, and later locally "enhanced" with the engraved brass cap and the crown from the badge, to be presented to Burland, perhaps when he became Lt.-Col.

In 1897, Burland was president of the Montreal Military Institute. As a result of his interest in small arms, he served as president of the Amalgamated Rifle Association in 1895 and as commandant of the Canadian rifle team when it won the McKinnon Challenge Cup at Bisley, Surrey, England, in 1902. He retired in 1908 with the rank of honorary lieutenant-colonel of the 1st Regiment (Prince of Wales’s Fusiliers). From 1911 to 1913 he presided over the Dominion Rifle Association and he had held office in local, provincial, and federal rifle associations. He was also prominent in the Boy Scout movement, serving as provincial commissioner from 1910 to 1914. He died in October 1914.

fernando · 29th March 2023, 10:25 AM

MacCathain, please upload your pictures using forum attachment features.

Kmaddock · 29th March 2023, 02:53 PM

Hi All,

In Reference to what is carved on the various examples:

Harp and shamrock self explanatory

The Dog is an Irish Wolf hound a historical hunting dog from Ireland and features a lot in Irish mythology. (very similar in size and looks to a great Dane).

The tower is know as a "Round Tower" and are to be found by monasteries and were used in the time of the Viking raids as a place of refuge for monks.

Google "Glendalough round tower" and you will se a beautiful example still standing

That is a beautiful example of workmanship shown by Mac Cathain
Regards
Ken

5th May 2017, 01:13 PM	#1
BANDOOK Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: AUCKLAND,NEW ZEALAND Posts: 624	IRISH POLICE BILLY CLUB NIGHTSTICK ,CA 1900 Just Added To My Collection From Early 1900s Is This Irish Police Club made of heavy Dark Wood. Carved With Shamrocks,Celtic Harp,A Hound Dog,and has a Leather Wrist Thong LENGTH 14 " HAS ANY MEMBER HAVE THESE IN YOUR COLLECTION PLEASE POST EXAMPLES,REGARDS RAJESH Attached Images

27th March 2023, 06:26 PM	#5
Lee EAAF Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Upstate New York, USA Posts: 913	Noggin Knocker I must have missed this informative and helpful thread when it was fresh and I discovered it only when doing a Google search after acquiring an example at a New York State rural auction a few days ago. I had presumed it must have been for the tourist, owing to the depiction of Blarney Castle but I liked the theme including the stone tower and the high relief carved shamrocks. The material was a mystery to me until I read Ken's comments - thank you! This example is 15 1/8 inches in length and weighs 17.7 ounces. Somehow I suspect that a 'priest' is nominally to a fish dispatching tool exactly as a 'shillelagh' is to a walking stick. Attached Images

29th March 2023, 12:49 AM	#8
MacCathain Member Join Date: Apr 2017 Posts: 66	Bog wood swagger stick A friend gave me this example of the breed about 10 years ago. It's a bit more interesting than the typical priest as it is named to its original owner, and is 71.6cm/28.2" in length. As such, it is too short for a walking stick, but too long and heavy for whacking salmon. It is, however, the ideal size for a military officer's swagger stick, albeit a beefy one. It was originally the property of Jeffrey Hale Burland, who was a noted Montreal businessman, philanthropist and Lt.-Col. of the 6th Battalion of Infantry, Canadian Militia. His name and rank are engraved on the brass cap that adorns the head of the stick. The cap is 38mm/1.5" in length and 25.4mm/1" in diameter, and is soldered to the face of a brass uniform button of the 6th Battalion. I would bet that the wood underneath the cap is cross-hatched in the same way as the priests posted above. The other end of the stick shows where a small brass ferrule was once fitted. The stick is well-carved with the same shamrocks, vines and leaves as shown in the posts above. The carving includes an Irish harp in relief, over which is mounted a brass Victorian crown that appears to have been repurposed from a military badge. On the side opposite of the harp is a relief carving of a dog in repose. With a square muzzle and erect ears, it looks like it represents a Great Dane, but I'm certain it's intended as a generic depiction. Burland was commissioned in the 6th Battalion of Infantry in 1882. Ten years later, he commanded the regiment. Given that the rank of Lt.-Col. precedes his name on the stick's brass cap, I would surmise that the stick itself was made between 1892 and 1898, when Burland held that rank and before the 6th was amalgamated with the 1st Battalion Prince of Wales Regiment to form the Prince of Wales' Regiment Fusiliers. I'd guess the stick was acquired in its base form, and later locally "enhanced" with the engraved brass cap and the crown from the badge, to be presented to Burland, perhaps when he became Lt.-Col. In 1897, Burland was president of the Montreal Military Institute. As a result of his interest in small arms, he served as president of the Amalgamated Rifle Association in 1895 and as commandant of the Canadian rifle team when it won the McKinnon Challenge Cup at Bisley, Surrey, England, in 1902. He retired in 1908 with the rank of honorary lieutenant-colonel of the 1st Regiment (Prince of Wales’s Fusiliers). From 1911 to 1913 he presided over the Dominion Rifle Association and he had held office in local, provincial, and federal rifle associations. He was also prominent in the Boy Scout movement, serving as provincial commissioner from 1910 to 1914. He died in October 1914. Attached Images Last edited by MacCathain; 29th March 2023 at 05:29 PM. Reason: Images from host links not allowed

5th May 2017, 02:25 PM	#2
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 543	Hi It is made from Bog Oak, this is Oak which fell into a bog around 10,000 years ago and buried in a few meters of bog The oak turns into this extremely heavy dense black wood. Yew and pines also are found and they go a more red golden colour. This wood is v v tough and difficult to work with as it is impregnated with silt and sand. These batons come up fairly regularly at auctions here in Ireland identified as many different things. Generally quiet short for a batton and the use i believe they are for is a batton killing fish sometimes called a "Priest". Google" bog oak sculpture" and you will see lots of carvings and a more detailed explanation of the formation of bog oak. I did sculpture years ago and this material blunted chisels in minutes. Regards and nice item by the way Ken

5th May 2017, 03:25 PM	#3
thinreadline Member Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Wirral Posts: 1,204	very nice . I do agree with Ken , these are normally classed as 'priests' for dispatching salmon .

28th March 2023, 09:02 PM	#7
Norman McCormick Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 1,597	Hi, I have one of these, got it with other bits and pieces in a sale. It is 12 1/2 inches long and 11.1 ozs. As an occasional fresh and sea water fisherman I can well imagine it would do the job of a fisherman's priest very well but I get the feeling that these are more of a souvenir than anything else. They all seem to have the same basic adornment i.e. shamrocks, Irish Celtic harp motifs and crosshatching. They are nicely produced items and I wouldn't like to be on the receiving end of one but I am not convinced that they are anything other than a well crafted item for those who travel. Regards, Norman

29th March 2023, 10:25 AM	#9
fernando (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Portugal Posts: 9,694	MacCathain, please upload your pictures using forum attachment features.

29th March 2023, 02:53 PM	#10
Kmaddock Member Join Date: May 2014 Location: Ireland Posts: 543	Hi All, In Reference to what is carved on the various examples: Harp and shamrock self explanatory The Dog is an Irish Wolf hound a historical hunting dog from Ireland and features a lot in Irish mythology. (very similar in size and looks to a great Dane). The tower is know as a "Round Tower" and are to be found by monasteries and were used in the time of the Viking raids as a place of refuge for monks. Google "Glendalough round tower" and you will se a beautiful example still standing That is a beautiful example of workmanship shown by Mac Cathain Regards Ken