Comments on Nias sword - Claws, Tusks and Fangs needed.

Naga Basuki · 7th February 2005, 04:06 PM

I recently acquired this Nias sword. As you can see from the pictures the talismanic ball needs rebuilding.

As I understand it Nias Warriors collected "power objects" like claws, tusks and fangs of dangerous beasts to enclose some sort of ritual objects, perhaps fetishes.

Would like to know what was in the ball also.

Tiger claws and large crocodile teeth were preferred.

To give an idea about size, the sword blade is about 20" long. I have not yet received the sword, it is in transit, but the ball is about 4" in diameter.

I also enclose a link to a Nias on Oriental Arms website (sold already) for comparision as to what it should look like.

http://www.oriental-arms.com/item.php?id=1189

I am not familiar with Nias and would appreciate any input as to where I might buy some fangs, claws or tusks. Boar tusks are plentiful. Tiger's fangs are hard to get in the open market.

I also would like input on the Nias sword.

BluErf · 7th February 2005, 04:15 PM

From what I've heard, the basket ball is meant as a receptacle for the ears of opponents vanquished by the wielder. Its like to keep track of the number of 'kills'. I have no way of telling 'fact or fiction' on that one though.

fearn · 7th February 2005, 04:28 PM

Just in general, Naga, I'd suggest that trying to import tiger's claws will land you in CITES trouble. Most conservation groups are seriously worried about tigers going extinct, and while they're undoubtedly being poached, I'd suggest that no sword needs such fresh decorations at this time.

Crocodile teeth might be available from Australia (I'm trying to remember if there are legal kills of saltwater crocs), and boars tusks might be available from hunters or farmers.

A lesser, but legal, option is to use resin casts. These are prevalent in Native American costumes these days, replacing eagle and bear claws, among other things. They aren't genuine, but these days, there's a lot to be said for letting the animals live.

F

Rick · 7th February 2005, 04:52 PM

Bill , Boars tusk source .

BOONE TRADING COMPANY 1-800-423-1945

In my example (now Lee's) the tusks were drilled at the base and the tip and were attached with what looked like sinew . It looks like your example still has the talismans inside the ball .

VANDOO · 7th February 2005, 06:36 PM

YOUR EXAMPLE HAS BOARS TUSKS SO THAT IS WHAT I WOULD USE TO COMPLETE YOUR EXAMPLE, THEY ARE EASIER TO OBTAIN ALSO. I HAVE SEEN A FEW NIAS SWORDS SOLD OVER THE YEARS WITH TIGER TEETH AND CROCODILE TEETH BUT THEY ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN AND EXPENSIVE.
I SUSPECT THAT THE FETISH INSIDE THE BALL IS FOR PROTECTION, SUCESS IN BATTLE AND POWER SO EACH ONE WOULD BE MADE FOR THAT WARRIOR. I DOUBT THAT THEY WERE OPENED AND CLOSED AFTER EVERY BATTLE TO ADD EARS IF SUCESSFUL, BUT IT MAKES A GOOD STORY

IN MOST CULTURES AS FAR AS I KNOW IF A FETISH GETS YOU THRU A BATTLE AND YOU ARE SUCESSFUL AGAINST THE ENEMY IT IS CONSIDERED POWERFUL AND THE MORE SUCESSFUL THE WARRIOR IS AND THE MORE BATTLES SURVIVED THE MORE POWERFUL THE TAILSMAN. THAT BEING THE CASE I DOUBT IT WOULD BE MESSED WITH EXCEPT TO REPAIR IT OR DURING SOME SPECIAL CEREMONY.

THEY STILL MAKE THESE SWORDS IN NIAS AND I DOUBT THAT YOUR EXAMPLE IS OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEEN USE, BUT IS A BETTER EXAMPLE THAN THOSE THAT ONLY HAVE TEETH CARVED OUT OF WOOD. MY EXAMPLE IS OF THAT SORT IT HAS WOODEN CROCODILE TEETH, AND I DOUBT THAT A PROPER TAILSMAN WAS PUT INTO THE FETISH BALL ON SUCH SWORDS. I WOULD SAY THAT THESE SWORDS ARE ETHINOGRAPHIC IN THAT THEY ARE MADE BY THE TRIBE, USING OLD DESIGNS BUT NEWER TOOLS AND MATERIALS. THEY MAY BE USED IN CEREMONYS, TOURIST SHOWS AND SOLD AS SOUVINEERS. DOES ANYONE HAVE A GOOD OLD EXAMPLE WITH A WATERED STEEL BLADE? IF SO I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME PICTURES.

UNFORTUNATELY I NEVER GOT TO VISIT NIAS AND THEY WERE ONE OF THE ISLANDS HARD HIT BY THE EARTHQUAKE AND TSUNAMI. I HOPE THEY ARE GETTING HELP TO GET BACK ON THEIR FEET AS THEY HAVE A VERY INTERESTING CULTURE AND HISTORY.

tom hyle · 8th February 2005, 07:14 AM

I generally don't feel you should modify a fetish or ritual object whose meaning, construction, and use you don't understand; such action can be detrimental to its spirit, mood, power, and lifetimes of experience and use. Also, this tusk-ball looks like it's in pretty good shape, anyway. I might tie down any loose ends, but replacing parts without the proper rituals, respect, and communications could be very harmful to whatever psychic field it has going. Replacing parts meant for a purpose with parts meant for show is a dangerous and slippery slope. Many people have no respect for this kind of talk, about invisible things, but I frankly don't know that such people should even be allowed near old magical/religious items....respect means taking someone for who he is; not for where you'd like to fit him into your pre-existing world. I'm a freind to the swords.....I gurss I feel this ritual ball is fairly clearly more talismanic than a simple item of "dress" and is a valuable and meaningful object its own self. Then there's the fact that it's one thing to kill someone and take his teeth, and it's another to buy teeth, and are objects made out of the two types of teeth truly the same object? My concern in this case is for poluting the magical essence of the ball. BTW, note resemblance to a takraw ball.

7th February 2005, 04:06 PM	#1
Naga Basuki Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Big old machine shop/foundry/warehouse in Atlanta GA USA Posts: 51	Comments on Nias sword - Claws, Tusks and Fangs needed. I recently acquired this Nias sword. As you can see from the pictures the talismanic ball needs rebuilding. As I understand it Nias Warriors collected "power objects" like claws, tusks and fangs of dangerous beasts to enclose some sort of ritual objects, perhaps fetishes. Would like to know what was in the ball also. Tiger claws and large crocodile teeth were preferred. To give an idea about size, the sword blade is about 20" long. I have not yet received the sword, it is in transit, but the ball is about 4" in diameter. I also enclose a link to a Nias on Oriental Arms website (sold already) for comparision as to what it should look like. http://www.oriental-arms.com/item.php?id=1189 I am not familiar with Nias and would appreciate any input as to where I might buy some fangs, claws or tusks. Boar tusks are plentiful. Tiger's fangs are hard to get in the open market. I also would like input on the Nias sword. Attached Images

7th February 2005, 04:52 PM	#4
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	Why I Love Google Bill , Boars tusk source . BOONE TRADING COMPANY 1-800-423-1945 In my example (now Lee's) the tusks were drilled at the base and the tip and were attached with what looked like sinew . It looks like your example still has the talismans inside the ball .

8th February 2005, 07:14 AM	#6
tom hyle Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Houston, TX, USA Posts: 1,254	I generally don't feel you should modify a fetish or ritual object whose meaning, construction, and use you don't understand; such action can be detrimental to its spirit, mood, power, and lifetimes of experience and use. Also, this tusk-ball looks like it's in pretty good shape, anyway. I might tie down any loose ends, but replacing parts without the proper rituals, respect, and communications could be very harmful to whatever psychic field it has going. Replacing parts meant for a purpose with parts meant for show is a dangerous and slippery slope. Many people have no respect for this kind of talk, about invisible things, but I frankly don't know that such people should even be allowed near old magical/religious items....respect means taking someone for who he is; not for where you'd like to fit him into your pre-existing world. I'm a freind to the swords.....I gurss I feel this ritual ball is fairly clearly more talismanic than a simple item of "dress" and is a valuable and meaningful object its own self. Then there's the fact that it's one thing to kill someone and take his teeth, and it's another to buy teeth, and are objects made out of the two types of teeth truly the same object? My concern in this case is for poluting the magical essence of the ball. BTW, note resemblance to a takraw ball. Last edited by tom hyle; 8th February 2005 at 08:19 AM.

7th February 2005, 04:15 PM	#2
BluErf Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Singapore Posts: 1,180	From what I've heard, the basket ball is meant as a receptacle for the ears of opponents vanquished by the wielder. Its like to keep track of the number of 'kills'. I have no way of telling 'fact or fiction' on that one though.

7th February 2005, 04:28 PM	#3
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Just in general, Naga, I'd suggest that trying to import tiger's claws will land you in CITES trouble. Most conservation groups are seriously worried about tigers going extinct, and while they're undoubtedly being poached, I'd suggest that no sword needs such fresh decorations at this time. Crocodile teeth might be available from Australia (I'm trying to remember if there are legal kills of saltwater crocs), and boars tusks might be available from hunters or farmers. A lesser, but legal, option is to use resin casts. These are prevalent in Native American costumes these days, replacing eagle and bear claws, among other things. They aren't genuine, but these days, there's a lot to be said for letting the animals live. F

7th February 2005, 06:36 PM	#5
VANDOO (deceased) Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: OKLAHOMA, USA Posts: 3,138	YOUR EXAMPLE HAS BOARS TUSKS SO THAT IS WHAT I WOULD USE TO COMPLETE YOUR EXAMPLE, THEY ARE EASIER TO OBTAIN ALSO. I HAVE SEEN A FEW NIAS SWORDS SOLD OVER THE YEARS WITH TIGER TEETH AND CROCODILE TEETH BUT THEY ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN AND EXPENSIVE. I SUSPECT THAT THE FETISH INSIDE THE BALL IS FOR PROTECTION, SUCESS IN BATTLE AND POWER SO EACH ONE WOULD BE MADE FOR THAT WARRIOR. I DOUBT THAT THEY WERE OPENED AND CLOSED AFTER EVERY BATTLE TO ADD EARS IF SUCESSFUL, BUT IT MAKES A GOOD STORY IN MOST CULTURES AS FAR AS I KNOW IF A FETISH GETS YOU THRU A BATTLE AND YOU ARE SUCESSFUL AGAINST THE ENEMY IT IS CONSIDERED POWERFUL AND THE MORE SUCESSFUL THE WARRIOR IS AND THE MORE BATTLES SURVIVED THE MORE POWERFUL THE TAILSMAN. THAT BEING THE CASE I DOUBT IT WOULD BE MESSED WITH EXCEPT TO REPAIR IT OR DURING SOME SPECIAL CEREMONY. THEY STILL MAKE THESE SWORDS IN NIAS AND I DOUBT THAT YOUR EXAMPLE IS OLD ENOUGH TO HAVE SEEN USE, BUT IS A BETTER EXAMPLE THAN THOSE THAT ONLY HAVE TEETH CARVED OUT OF WOOD. MY EXAMPLE IS OF THAT SORT IT HAS WOODEN CROCODILE TEETH, AND I DOUBT THAT A PROPER TAILSMAN WAS PUT INTO THE FETISH BALL ON SUCH SWORDS. I WOULD SAY THAT THESE SWORDS ARE ETHINOGRAPHIC IN THAT THEY ARE MADE BY THE TRIBE, USING OLD DESIGNS BUT NEWER TOOLS AND MATERIALS. THEY MAY BE USED IN CEREMONYS, TOURIST SHOWS AND SOLD AS SOUVINEERS. DOES ANYONE HAVE A GOOD OLD EXAMPLE WITH A WATERED STEEL BLADE? IF SO I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SOME PICTURES. UNFORTUNATELY I NEVER GOT TO VISIT NIAS AND THEY WERE ONE OF THE ISLANDS HARD HIT BY THE EARTHQUAKE AND TSUNAMI. I HOPE THEY ARE GETTING HELP TO GET BACK ON THEIR FEET AS THEY HAVE A VERY INTERESTING CULTURE AND HISTORY.