chinese ram

bvieira · 11th September 2018, 06:06 PM

Hello,

I have this ram in my collection, don't know much about it, the material is copper with a gold bath!

Anybody has anything similar ?

Regards,

BV

Jon MB · 16th October 2018, 03:01 PM

My guess would be Qing dynasty 18th/ 19th C. in earlier style. Copper repousse with fire guilding. If genuine.

josh stout · 16th October 2018, 10:02 PM

it's one of those "if genuine" situations, but Qing figurines like this can be quite valuable.

I can't tell its age by looking at the pictures, nevertheless, I don't see anything wrong with it. It is similar in style and construction to other genuine things.

It looks like mercury gilding, which would place it in the late Qing.

josh stout · 16th October 2018, 10:08 PM

On another look, I am slightly suspicious of the globs sitting on top of the gold. Is it trying to look like truly ancient encrusted mineral deposits? That is not a good sign. I don't think it is ancient.

On the other hand, the Qing did copy earlier work, so it could be an old copy. Most copies are modern.

Jon MB · 17th October 2018, 03:22 PM

https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/Colle...OrigTitle=true

As Josh pointed out, modern copies and fakes exist.... I am not saying yours is a fake per se, only that animals like this are a popular theme for fakers.

If yours is made from copper and is hollow, that is a good sign, but as Josh says, the splattering is odd and looks like and attempt to create the kind of corrosion seen on early items like Warring States period artefacts that have been excavated.

The item illustrated here is a typical modern solid casting in brass that has been chemically treated to create an 'aged' effect.

bvieira · 23rd October 2018, 10:46 AM

Hello and thank you all for the opinions!

I have seen these copies on ebay, but they are very diferent if you check the details on both pieces these ebay ones i have no doubts they are machine made, the one i have you can see that's a unique piece that was worked by hand by a craftsman...

When and where was made and how much is worth is my big doubt!

I analyze the black material that the object was in some parts, my suspect is that this object was involved somehow in a fire and that material is burned material from other objects, behind the material there is still the gold bath intacted, the gold protected the object.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C70dsq4em9k i have found this video there is a similar but bronze and bigger at second 10 to 14...

Regards,

BV

11th September 2018, 06:06 PM	#1
bvieira Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 108	chinese ram Hello, I have this ram in my collection, don't know much about it, the material is copper with a gold bath! Anybody has anything similar ? Regards, BV Attached Images

17th October 2018, 03:22 PM	#5
Jon MB Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 143	https://ru.aliexpress.com/item/Colle...OrigTitle=true As Josh pointed out, modern copies and fakes exist.... I am not saying yours is a fake per se, only that animals like this are a popular theme for fakers. If yours is made from copper and is hollow, that is a good sign, but as Josh says, the splattering is odd and looks like and attempt to create the kind of corrosion seen on early items like Warring States period artefacts that have been excavated. The item illustrated here is a typical modern solid casting in brass that has been chemically treated to create an 'aged' effect. Attached Images Last edited by Jon MB; 17th October 2018 at 03:46 PM.

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16th October 2018, 03:01 PM	#2
Jon MB Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Posts: 143	My guess would be Qing dynasty 18th/ 19th C. in earlier style. Copper repousse with fire guilding. If genuine.

16th October 2018, 10:02 PM	#3
josh stout Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 407	it's one of those "if genuine" situations, but Qing figurines like this can be quite valuable. I can't tell its age by looking at the pictures, nevertheless, I don't see anything wrong with it. It is similar in style and construction to other genuine things. It looks like mercury gilding, which would place it in the late Qing.

16th October 2018, 10:08 PM	#4
josh stout Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 407	On another look, I am slightly suspicious of the globs sitting on top of the gold. Is it trying to look like truly ancient encrusted mineral deposits? That is not a good sign. I don't think it is ancient. On the other hand, the Qing did copy earlier work, so it could be an old copy. Most copies are modern.

23rd October 2018, 10:46 AM	#6
bvieira Member Join Date: Jul 2018 Posts: 108	Hello and thank you all for the opinions! I have seen these copies on ebay, but they are very diferent if you check the details on both pieces these ebay ones i have no doubts they are machine made, the one i have you can see that's a unique piece that was worked by hand by a craftsman... When and where was made and how much is worth is my big doubt! I analyze the black material that the object was in some parts, my suspect is that this object was involved somehow in a fire and that material is burned material from other objects, behind the material there is still the gold bath intacted, the gold protected the object. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C70dsq4em9k i have found this video there is a similar but bronze and bigger at second 10 to 14... Regards, BV