Fire tempering.

Tim Simmons · 15th October 2014, 06:20 PM

Fire tempering wood and fire as a medium for decorative purposes.

I recently purchased an early 20th or even late 19th century New Hebrides club. This club sparked a deeper thought. The club has been fire hardened, or at the very least fire has been used to alter the nature and appearance of the wood. I show it here with a similar version with a rich patina. If one looks at the close up of the handle ends. You can see where the dark red brown wood shows through the charred surface, and has taken a polish patina through use. The distal end remains black but it too has taken a patina.

I think we are all aware of hardening a spear tip with fire and the use of heat to straighten arrows and spears. This if not a skill {which I think it is} then it is something that needs much practice. It is more than just burning the end of a stick. Now think of the controlled burning of a whole club. I suggest to achieve an overall controlled delicate charring either to harden or as to change the colour of the wood is a skill.

Fire just for decoration.
Look at the big Amazon Shavanti club. Here we see the wood has been charred and polished to form a contrast pattern. To achieve this the maker must have used a fire retardant material much in the same way as Japanese sword smiths. Obviously not for the same reason, but does show it is not just an object made crudely for the purpose of killing. There is more to it. i find it all very interesting.

spiral · 15th October 2014, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

Fire just for decoration.
Look at the big Amazon Shavanti club. Here we see the wood has been charred and polished to form a contrast pattern. To achieve this the maker must have used a fire retardant material much in the same way as Japanese sword smiths. Obviously not for the same reason, but does show it is not just an object made crudely for the purpose of killing. There is more to it. i find it all very interesting.

I think Tim, It could also be done in a localised area of the stick with large candle or even a butane gas torch...Leaving unburnt areas of wood. There nothing I can see to imply it was done during over a camp type fire scenario?

spiral

Tim Simmons · 15th October 2014, 10:05 PM

That is possible. What if they where also after the overall tempering. Simply burning the surface is not fire tempering. Also the people mentioned where no Larramie Loafers?

spiral · 15th October 2014, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim Simmons

That is possible. What if they where also after the overall tempering. Simply burning the surface is not fire tempering. Also the people mentioned where no Larramie Loafers?

I agree burning is not tempering... I cant tell from photos if that piece is burnt or tempered though? if tempered , intermittent pattern seems strange?

I get the impression from the film I linked to in this thread..

linky

That the fire tempering requires heating & smoking, to generally fast season & harden, by driving out moisture, rather than surface burning?

spiral

Film linky..
linky

Rick · 15th October 2014, 10:57 PM

I've heard of some Kentucky Long Rifles decorated with fire using a cord soaked in flammables, wrapped around the stock and lit off .
The result is a striped look to the stock and forend of the gun .

A. G. Maisey · 15th October 2014, 11:22 PM

I would suggest that correct terminology is "fire hardening", not "fire tempering".

The character of the wood is made harder by the skilled use of heat applied to the surface.

In working with steel, the tempering process is carried out after the steel has been hardened, and its purpose is to soften the steel so that it is not brittle and is able to be used.

Perhaps an argument could be mounted for the use of "temper", in that broad use of the word "temper" can be interpreted as to modify the state of something so that there is no excess in either direction, with wood treated by fire it is modified so that it is neither too soft, as in its natural state, nor too brittle as it would be with excess application of heat.

Very often lay people will refer to the heat treatment of steel after forging as "tempering", which is only the second part of the process needed to make it useable after forging.

With wood, the second part of the process after hardening is not necessary, so perhaps a more accurate use of language here might be "hardening", rather than "tempering" ?

spiral · 15th October 2014, 11:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

I would suggest that correct terminology is "fire hardening", not "fire tempering".

The character of the wood is made harder by the skilled use of heat applied to the surface.

In working with steel, the tempering process is carried out after the steel has been hardened, and its purpose is to soften the steel so that it is not brittle and is able to be used.

Perhaps an argument could be mounted for the use of "temper", in that broad use of the word "temper" can be interpreted as to modify the state of something so that there is no excess in either direction, with wood treated by fire it is modified so that it is neither too soft, as in its natural state, nor too brittle as it would be with excess application of heat.

Very often lay people will refer to the heat treatment of steel after forging as "tempering", which is only the second part of the process needed to make it useable after forging.

With wood, the second part of the process after hardening is not necessary, so perhaps a more accurate use of language here might be "hardening", rather than "tempering" ?

Well fire hardening is perhaps a better term, but I wouldn't lose any sleep over the word tempering....

After all we are talking about timber not steel or glass....

The word origin for tempered is probably the latin tempor for time or season, heating the timber over a fire advances does that process... {not unlike the much more controlled kiln drying to speed the process.}

spiral

spiral · 15th October 2014, 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

I've heard of some Kentucky Long Rifles decorated with fire using a cord soaked in flammables, wrapped around the stock and lit off .
The result is a striped look to the stock and forend of the gun .

I guess that was an attempt to mimic the fiddleback maple look?

spiral

A. G. Maisey · 16th October 2014, 01:58 AM

Yeah, I agree, use of tempering is no big deal, the reason I have commented is because when I saw it was about wood the use of the word confused me until I read further.

Roots are Latin>temperare,Old English>temprian,Old French>tremper(sense development).

Temperare is to moderate, tempo and tempor are related to time.

My apologies for being pedantic.

15th October 2014, 06:20 PM	#1
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	Fire tempering. Fire tempering wood and fire as a medium for decorative purposes. I recently purchased an early 20th or even late 19th century New Hebrides club. This club sparked a deeper thought. The club has been fire hardened, or at the very least fire has been used to alter the nature and appearance of the wood. I show it here with a similar version with a rich patina. If one looks at the close up of the handle ends. You can see where the dark red brown wood shows through the charred surface, and has taken a polish patina through use. The distal end remains black but it too has taken a patina. I think we are all aware of hardening a spear tip with fire and the use of heat to straighten arrows and spears. This if not a skill {which I think it is} then it is something that needs much practice. It is more than just burning the end of a stick. Now think of the controlled burning of a whole club. I suggest to achieve an overall controlled delicate charring either to harden or as to change the colour of the wood is a skill. Fire just for decoration. Look at the big Amazon Shavanti club. Here we see the wood has been charred and polished to form a contrast pattern. To achieve this the maker must have used a fire retardant material much in the same way as Japanese sword smiths. Obviously not for the same reason, but does show it is not just an object made crudely for the purpose of killing. There is more to it. i find it all very interesting. Attached Images

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15th October 2014, 10:05 PM	#3
Tim Simmons Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: What is still UK Posts: 5,807	That is possible. What if they where also after the overall tempering. Simply burning the surface is not fire tempering. Also the people mentioned where no Larramie Loafers?

15th October 2014, 10:57 PM	#5
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,293	I've heard of some Kentucky Long Rifles decorated with fire using a cord soaked in flammables, wrapped around the stock and lit off . The result is a striped look to the stock and forend of the gun .

15th October 2014, 11:22 PM	#6
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,897	I would suggest that correct terminology is "fire hardening", not "fire tempering". The character of the wood is made harder by the skilled use of heat applied to the surface. In working with steel, the tempering process is carried out after the steel has been hardened, and its purpose is to soften the steel so that it is not brittle and is able to be used. Perhaps an argument could be mounted for the use of "temper", in that broad use of the word "temper" can be interpreted as to modify the state of something so that there is no excess in either direction, with wood treated by fire it is modified so that it is neither too soft, as in its natural state, nor too brittle as it would be with excess application of heat. Very often lay people will refer to the heat treatment of steel after forging as "tempering", which is only the second part of the process needed to make it useable after forging. With wood, the second part of the process after hardening is not necessary, so perhaps a more accurate use of language here might be "hardening", rather than "tempering" ?

16th October 2014, 01:58 AM	#9
A. G. Maisey Member Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 6,897	Yeah, I agree, use of tempering is no big deal, the reason I have commented is because when I saw it was about wood the use of the word confused me until I read further. Roots are Latin>temperare,Old English>temprian,Old French>tremper(sense development). Temperare is to moderate, tempo and tempor are related to time. My apologies for being pedantic.