Sword with Eagle head and Ivory handle

Coomagirl · 26th July 2011, 08:18 AM

I'm new to this, I need some help finding the origin of the sword I have bought on e-bay. There was a thread I followed back in 2009 about a similar find. Mine has an Eagle head and the handle seems to be Bone or Ivory with wire wrapped around it. The blade itself has VOC stamped on it as well as a sailing ship and the word Batavia inscribed.

Atlantia · 26th July 2011, 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coomagirl

I'm new to this, I need some help finding the origin of the sword I have bought on e-bay. There was a thread I followed back in 2009 about a similar find. Mine has an Eagle head and the handle seems to be Bone or Ivory with wire wrapped around it. The blade itself has VOC stamped on it as well as a sailing ship and the word Batavia inscribed.

HI,
Can you upload pictures?
If not, then when did you buy it, are the pictures still on eBAy to look at?
Gene

Jeff D · 28th July 2011, 05:34 AM

Is it similar to this one? The most notorious sword ever discussed on this board.

http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000140.html

All the Best

P.S. For you Jim

M ELEY · 28th July 2011, 07:56 AM

Run away! Run away! (Monty Python had it right!)

Atlantia · 28th July 2011, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff D

Is it similar to this one? The most notorious sword ever discussed on this board.

http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000140.html

All the Best

P.S. For you Jim

Hey Jeff,
Must admit that was my though too.

Rick · 28th July 2011, 04:52 PM

Is the blade marked, dare I say it, Shaver Cool ?

Maurice · 28th July 2011, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Is the blade marked, dare I say it, Shaver Cool ?

LOL....Not the shaver cool again!

asomotif · 28th July 2011, 07:54 PM

Aahhhhh... Hot potato, orchestra stalls, Puck will make amends
(quote from Blackadder

)

Maybe we should refer to the "sticky sword", instead of " sh..er c..l ".
(I do not dare to type the words..

)

Maurice · 28th July 2011, 08:23 PM

For those who don't dare to write down the word "shaver cool", we can use next sign so we all know what you mean...

M ELEY · 29th July 2011, 01:05 AM

You guys are killing me!!!!!!!!

Absolutely no disrespect meant for your question Coomagirl. It's just that this one created a legend...

Jim McDougall · 29th July 2011, 01:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rick

Is the blade marked, dare I say it, Shaver Cool ?

Auuughhhhh!!!! Nightmares....you have spoken the unspeakable

LOL!

Coomagirl, please pardon our frivolity, but if you look at the classic threads under these words 'SHAVER KOOL' you will see why we all cringe. If you or anyone out there reading knows of a very old Abbott & Costello movie (cannot recall the title) but in a scene where they are jailed with a delerious miscreant, he recounts the tale that led to his ending up there. He tells of an event where upon hearing the name of a river...pocoloco....he suddenly is crazed and strangles the person he sees next to him...and how he strangled his partner. He heard the word pocoloco......and 'slowly I turned....step by step..inch by inch...I placed my fingers around his neck!!!'

Then the comic two began asking questions, but every time Abbott said pocoloco, the derelict roared and grabbed Costello by the neck, chanting, step by step etc etc. He would suddenly relent...with Costello gasping...then Abbott would say it again, with Costello pleading for him to stop saying it!

The 'SHAVER KOOL' thread seemed neverending, going on for years, with the same relentless anguish and indeed...became a legend of the forums.

We're all experiencing that conditioned response accordingly

It seems that in the Shaver Kool thread (can be viewed in the classic threads list sticky at top of forum) which managed to persist from 2000 to 2005, swords of this type were issued in the Indonesian Navy as 'swords of honor' in about the 1960s, but uncertain how much before or after. The VOC stand for the Dutch East India company, whose heritage stands in Java and particularly Batavia (now Jakarta). There was also a famed shipwreck of one of these early ships named the 'Batavia'. These swords seem to have come up over the years on occasion on ebay. The 'eagle' head is believed to be a gryphon but often is perceived to be the mythical 'Garuda' as well.

All best regards,
Jim

P>S> Thanks guys

memories !!!! LOL.

Coomagirl · 29th July 2011, 02:24 AM

thanks guys, I thought it may stir up a few memories, as I had to follow many threads dating back to 2009 to lead me to here. I will enclose the pictures but as you can see there is no mention of the dreaded 'Shaver Cool' on this one..

Coomagirl · 29th July 2011, 02:32 AM

Pictures won't upload as they are too big, need to find out a way to shrink them..

Coomagirl · 29th July 2011, 02:57 AM

Photos of sword.

Coomagirl · 29th July 2011, 03:06 AM

and 2 more photos. It was bought quite a while ago. Put away and So I never found out from the threads whether it was a souvenier or original. Is it worth anything or just a talking piece for the mantle?
thanks for your quick responses.

Rick · 29th July 2011, 05:46 PM

My eyes !
The goggles do no good !

That's the culprit .

Not sure if we definitively came to a conclusion as to it's place in the hierarchy of 'old swords' .

These weapons certainly do not look like they would stand up to conflict (other than over opinions about them ) .

fearn · 29th July 2011, 06:02 PM

Hi Rick,

So which forum does it belong in again?

Seriously, these are the most "magical" swords ever posted on the forum, especially given the reactions they cause. Every self-respecting sorcerer needs a sword marked "shiver kewl," don't you think?

F

M ELEY · 31st July 2011, 02:44 AM

Definately not fighters. Perhaps some pre-date the "60's". Fraternal or as honor swords as Jim astutely pointed out. I've seen an earlier varient in some of Fagan's and Frederick's Sword catalogs that I'm convinced is the original pattern for these swords. Always listed as an Indonesian officer's (?) dress sword from WWII period with same griffon-type head, but a guard that oddly twists like an ocean wave (naval??). Perhaps I can find a pic of one of these...

Jim McDougall · 31st July 2011, 05:31 AM

Thanks again Jeff, and Mark!!!

Coomagirl, thank you for being such a good sport with all of this, and for giving us all a fun memory.

While the sword itself may not be of great value, it certainly has a kind of intrinsic appeal, and apparantly someone took some effort to allude to the history of the VOC (Vereenigde Oost Indische Compagnie, VOC) the Dutch India Co. As I mentioned, these particular swords appear to have been commercially produced and used in some regard associated with the Indonesian Navy. Obviously they were never intended to be combat weapons, but ceremonial regalia.

Whoever put the scribed markings on this sword apparantly used detail out of references to suggest historical connections, but not especially well done.
The sword itself is of mid to latter 19th century style, resembling many swords for naval officers, and clearly later than the 1798 end of the VOC.
As noted, these kinds of swords were produced well into the 20th century, into the 60s.

Whether to keep it or not? As always, up to the individual, but if anything, its a conversation piece here, and now part of one of the true legends of forum lore.

All the very best,
Jim

Coomagirl · 3rd August 2011, 06:21 AM

thanks for all your help Guys, this has been a very interesting journey. Plan to keep searching for the elusive

Jim McDougall · 3rd August 2011, 09:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Coomagirl

thanks for all your help Guys, this has been a very interesting journey. Plan to keep searching for the elusive

We always do Coomagirl!!!...we always do !

werecow · 20th September 2022, 11:01 PM

I can't say where, since it's against the rules but I can't resist pointing out that I noticed today that someone is currently committed at an online auction for one of these to the tune of €700 (plus auction fee), with two more days of bidding left to go.

It's a bit more presentable than the one in this thread, but nevertheless.

werecow · 22nd September 2022, 07:36 PM

In the end some poor sod (who apparently is not following these boards) paid €1101 plus 9% auction fee and shipping for a Shaver Cool saber.

If you're reading this and this is now your sword, my condolences.

Radboud · 22nd September 2022, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by werecow

In the end some poor sod (who apparently is not following these boards) paid €1101 plus 9% auction fee and shipping for a Shaver Cool saber.

If you're reading this and this is now your sword, my condolences.

Sad to see these kinds of things still happening. Was it a professional auction company or just an eBay style auction?

werecow · 23rd September 2022, 02:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Radboud

Sad to see these kinds of things still happening. Was it a professional auction company or just an eBay style auction?

Catawiki.

M ELEY · 24th September 2022, 07:41 AM

It is pitiful, especially when the auction houses or antiques sellers are aware, but choose to play dumb when it comes to the item's authenticity. And not just swords. There are several 'reputable' sites listing fire axes, Boy Scout hatchets, soldier's side axes and even common tool hatchets as boarding axes for hefty sums. It's criminal...

Jim McDougall · 25th September 2022, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M ELEY

It is pitiful, especially when the auction houses or antiques sellers are aware, but choose to play dumb when it comes to the item's authenticity. And not just swords. There are several 'reputable' sites listing fire axes, Boy Scout hatchets, soldier's side axes and even common tool hatchets as boarding axes for hefty sums. It's criminal...

Sadly, a very well known ploy that has been used as long as I can remember. While many dealers take in all manner of 'offal' in trades and of course sell the choice pieces for the expected return, they take the 'less desirable' stuff and place in tempting 'no idea what this is' setting. With this, they 'allow' the wide eyed novices with 'just enough' knowledge to get themselves in trouble..to fill in the blanks. They buy! thinking they have outsmarted the wily dealer....but will of course discover later the inevitable.
The most important weapon a collector can possess is knowledge, and it should be constantly well honed.

26th July 2011, 08:18 AM	#1
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	Sword with Eagle head and Ivory handle I'm new to this, I need some help finding the origin of the sword I have bought on e-bay. There was a thread I followed back in 2009 about a similar find. Mine has an Eagle head and the handle seems to be Bone or Ivory with wire wrapped around it. The blade itself has VOC stamped on it as well as a sailing ship and the word Batavia inscribed.

28th July 2011, 08:23 PM	#9
Maurice Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 1,434	For those who don't dare to write down the word "shaver cool", we can use next sign so we all know what you mean... Attached Images

29th July 2011, 02:57 AM	#14
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	Photos of sword. Attached Images

29th July 2011, 03:06 AM	#15
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	and 2 more photos. It was bought quite a while ago. Put away and So I never found out from the threads whether it was a souvenier or original. Is it worth anything or just a talking piece for the mantle? thanks for your quick responses. Attached Images

28th July 2011, 05:34 AM	#3
Jeff D Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: B.C. Canada Posts: 473	Is it similar to this one? The most notorious sword ever discussed on this board. http://www.vikingsword.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000140.html All the Best P.S. For you Jim

28th July 2011, 07:56 AM	#4
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,138	Run away! Run away! (Monty Python had it right!)

28th July 2011, 04:52 PM	#6
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,325	Is the blade marked, dare I say it, Shaver Cool ?

28th July 2011, 07:54 PM	#8
asomotif Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The Netherlands Posts: 2,228	Aahhhhh... Hot potato, orchestra stalls, Puck will make amends (quote from Blackadder ) Maybe we should refer to the "sticky sword", instead of " sh..er c..l ". (I do not dare to type the words.. )

29th July 2011, 01:05 AM	#10
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,138	You guys are killing me!!!!!!!! Absolutely no disrespect meant for your question Coomagirl. It's just that this one created a legend...

29th July 2011, 02:24 AM	#12
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	thanks guys, I thought it may stir up a few memories, as I had to follow many threads dating back to 2009 to lead me to here. I will enclose the pictures but as you can see there is no mention of the dreaded 'Shaver Cool' on this one..

29th July 2011, 02:32 AM	#13
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	Pictures won't upload as they are too big, need to find out a way to shrink them..

29th July 2011, 05:46 PM	#16
Rick Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 6,325	My eyes ! The goggles do no good ! That's the culprit . Not sure if we definitively came to a conclusion as to it's place in the hierarchy of 'old swords' . These weapons certainly do not look like they would stand up to conflict (other than over opinions about them ) .

29th July 2011, 06:02 PM	#17
fearn Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 1,247	Hi Rick, So which forum does it belong in again? Seriously, these are the most "magical" swords ever posted on the forum, especially given the reactions they cause. Every self-respecting sorcerer needs a sword marked "shiver kewl," don't you think? F

31st July 2011, 02:44 AM	#18
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,138	Definately not fighters. Perhaps some pre-date the "60's". Fraternal or as honor swords as Jim astutely pointed out. I've seen an earlier varient in some of Fagan's and Frederick's Sword catalogs that I'm convinced is the original pattern for these swords. Always listed as an Indonesian officer's (?) dress sword from WWII period with same griffon-type head, but a guard that oddly twists like an ocean wave (naval??). Perhaps I can find a pic of one of these...

31st July 2011, 05:31 AM	#19
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,100	Thanks again Jeff, and Mark!!! Coomagirl, thank you for being such a good sport with all of this, and for giving us all a fun memory. While the sword itself may not be of great value, it certainly has a kind of intrinsic appeal, and apparantly someone took some effort to allude to the history of the VOC (Vereenigde Oost Indische Compagnie, VOC) the Dutch India Co. As I mentioned, these particular swords appear to have been commercially produced and used in some regard associated with the Indonesian Navy. Obviously they were never intended to be combat weapons, but ceremonial regalia. Whoever put the scribed markings on this sword apparantly used detail out of references to suggest historical connections, but not especially well done. The sword itself is of mid to latter 19th century style, resembling many swords for naval officers, and clearly later than the 1798 end of the VOC. As noted, these kinds of swords were produced well into the 20th century, into the 60s. Whether to keep it or not? As always, up to the individual, but if anything, its a conversation piece here, and now part of one of the true legends of forum lore. All the very best, Jim

3rd August 2011, 06:21 AM	#20
Coomagirl Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 7	thanks for all your help Guys, this has been a very interesting journey. Plan to keep searching for the elusive

20th September 2022, 11:01 PM	#22
werecow Member Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: Leiden, NL Posts: 534	I can't say where, since it's against the rules but I can't resist pointing out that I noticed today that someone is currently committed at an online auction for one of these to the tune of €700 (plus auction fee), with two more days of bidding left to go. It's a bit more presentable than the one in this thread, but nevertheless.

22nd September 2022, 07:36 PM	#23
werecow Member Join Date: Sep 2021 Location: Leiden, NL Posts: 534	In the end some poor sod (who apparently is not following these boards) paid €1101 plus 9% auction fee and shipping for a Shaver Cool saber. If you're reading this and this is now your sword, my condolences.

24th September 2022, 07:41 AM	#26
M ELEY Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: NC, U.S.A. Posts: 2,138	It is pitiful, especially when the auction houses or antiques sellers are aware, but choose to play dumb when it comes to the item's authenticity. And not just swords. There are several 'reputable' sites listing fire axes, Boy Scout hatchets, soldier's side axes and even common tool hatchets as boarding axes for hefty sums. It's criminal...