Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post - European sword from XVII or XVIII c.

Jim McDougall · 19th September 2009, 05:54 PM

I very much like the way you are thinking Buendia! You take a systematic approach to examining not just the marking, but the style and elements of the sword overall.

As noted, these swords with the thumbrings seem to have been mostly of 17th century, and used from Austria to North Europe and the Low Countries. It must be remembered that these times and regions were of course in a constant state of geopolitical flux, and warfare and trade throughout were a continually present dynamic.

Also, it is important to note that Solingen was a powerful industrial and merchandising machine in the production of sword blades, who duplicated the blades of many other centers. It would have been fruitless for any other center to try to duplicate a 'Solingen' blade, as Solingen blades were actually so often designed to impersonate blades of other countries.

Probably the most likely explanation for this marking, which is as you have noticed, is that it is actually a composite marking, probably applied to the blade after its production. As previously mentioned, it cannot be associated with a certain maker or city as it is an interpretation of known symbols or devices used either in amuletic or imbued quality sense.

The arch with triple dots at either end is of course from the 'Genoan' or 'sickle' mark usually occurring in opposed pair with dentated semi circle.
Its use in variation became known later as it was copied by many trade centers and blade makers even in native colonial areas.

The cross, again as you have well noted, describing the cross and orb, which was indeed used by a number of European swordsmiths, particularly in Solingen, was most likely used in talismanic sense. The cross is very much present in similar configuration occasionally with other amuletic devices as an invocation calling for divine protection and strength.

These were times of profound religious piety as well as of deep superstition and folklore, so the application of these symbols would seem well in place
applied to a mans sword, with which he defended his faith, his honor and his very life.

Your very astute interpretation of St. Peters cross is also quite plausible and well considered in this context.

All best regards,
Jim

19th September 2009, 05:54 PM	#17
Jim McDougall Arms Historian Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Route 66 Posts: 10,194	I very much like the way you are thinking Buendia! You take a systematic approach to examining not just the marking, but the style and elements of the sword overall. As noted, these swords with the thumbrings seem to have been mostly of 17th century, and used from Austria to North Europe and the Low Countries. It must be remembered that these times and regions were of course in a constant state of geopolitical flux, and warfare and trade throughout were a continually present dynamic. Also, it is important to note that Solingen was a powerful industrial and merchandising machine in the production of sword blades, who duplicated the blades of many other centers. It would have been fruitless for any other center to try to duplicate a 'Solingen' blade, as Solingen blades were actually so often designed to impersonate blades of other countries. Probably the most likely explanation for this marking, which is as you have noticed, is that it is actually a composite marking, probably applied to the blade after its production. As previously mentioned, it cannot be associated with a certain maker or city as it is an interpretation of known symbols or devices used either in amuletic or imbued quality sense. The arch with triple dots at either end is of course from the 'Genoan' or 'sickle' mark usually occurring in opposed pair with dentated semi circle. Its use in variation became known later as it was copied by many trade centers and blade makers even in native colonial areas. The cross, again as you have well noted, describing the cross and orb, which was indeed used by a number of European swordsmiths, particularly in Solingen, was most likely used in talismanic sense. The cross is very much present in similar configuration occasionally with other amuletic devices as an invocation calling for divine protection and strength. These were times of profound religious piety as well as of deep superstition and folklore, so the application of these symbols would seem well in place applied to a mans sword, with which he defended his faith, his honor and his very life. Your very astute interpretation of St. Peters cross is also quite plausible and well considered in this context. All best regards, Jim