Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

erlikhan · 14th December 2004, 02:32 PM

Yannis, the material is bronze as I told. About being fake or not, as many other, my basic criteria is who brings and offers it to market. I also understand your point of view but , about Schytian artifacts, if you search as" luristan" you will find many. They were nomads and warriors, having a superior bronze casting technology. They were also the first community to train horses enough to be used efficiently in wars starting mounted riding. First bronze, then iron working of nomads were always superior in any age(in general all kinds of metal, gold, silver etc. too), as strong,educated horses and efficient weapons were the things they needed to have whatever they wanted. As far as I know, they conquered and ruled today's Ukraine, Caucasia and Persia for several centuries, later forming a union till Egypt in 8th century b.c. So they have conquered not all, but much of the developed lands of their time .
About the date they belong to, some sources say 8-9th centuries b.c., and I knew like that till short time ago, but at that age, it had been more than 500 years since Hittites found iron working, and all near east was using iron instead of bronze, since it was much cheaper and easier to work. It doesnt seem logical for anybody to prefer expensive and difficult bronze swords at that age (but bronze continued to be used in helmets and shields, I dont know why). .
And, I learned the date 1500 b.c from the site of Azerbaijan national museum . They have samples like mines. They have dated their sample to b.c. 1500. Ariel had given its link in the previous forum. I dont remember it now. He can help us but I am unable to insist on the date as I am not an expert myself.
And one more sign about being fake or not, you can see many samples being sold in respectful auctions (not cyber. Real auctions). I can give you some links if you wish. Most have even much better conditions and sure much higher prices, compared to these ones. (Not only the Schytian ones, also Middle European ones, which was certainly not a civilized land in that age). Bronze stands against corrosion of natural effects under soil uncomparably better than iron. Thats why clean bronze age samples are more than much later's iron weapons of Roman, even Middle age times. But again, my judgement about being original or fake depends on just my feelings and reference books or auctions. The exact result can be taken only by carbon 14 test, nothing else i guess.

14th December 2004, 02:32 PM	#9
erlikhan Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Istanbul Posts: 452	Yannis, the material is bronze as I told. About being fake or not, as many other, my basic criteria is who brings and offers it to market. I also understand your point of view but , about Schytian artifacts, if you search as" luristan" you will find many. They were nomads and warriors, having a superior bronze casting technology. They were also the first community to train horses enough to be used efficiently in wars starting mounted riding. First bronze, then iron working of nomads were always superior in any age(in general all kinds of metal, gold, silver etc. too), as strong,educated horses and efficient weapons were the things they needed to have whatever they wanted. As far as I know, they conquered and ruled today's Ukraine, Caucasia and Persia for several centuries, later forming a union till Egypt in 8th century b.c. So they have conquered not all, but much of the developed lands of their time . About the date they belong to, some sources say 8-9th centuries b.c., and I knew like that till short time ago, but at that age, it had been more than 500 years since Hittites found iron working, and all near east was using iron instead of bronze, since it was much cheaper and easier to work. It doesnt seem logical for anybody to prefer expensive and difficult bronze swords at that age (but bronze continued to be used in helmets and shields, I dont know why). . And, I learned the date 1500 b.c from the site of Azerbaijan national museum . They have samples like mines. They have dated their sample to b.c. 1500. Ariel had given its link in the previous forum. I dont remember it now. He can help us but I am unable to insist on the date as I am not an expert myself. And one more sign about being fake or not, you can see many samples being sold in respectful auctions (not cyber. Real auctions). I can give you some links if you wish. Most have even much better conditions and sure much higher prices, compared to these ones. (Not only the Schytian ones, also Middle European ones, which was certainly not a civilized land in that age). Bronze stands against corrosion of natural effects under soil uncomparably better than iron. Thats why clean bronze age samples are more than much later's iron weapons of Roman, even Middle age times. But again, my judgement about being original or fake depends on just my feelings and reference books or auctions. The exact result can be taken only by carbon 14 test, nothing else i guess.