Ethnographic Arms & Armour - View Single Post

Ian · 18th June 2024, 12:12 PM

Hi Iain,

Three days, about 230 views, and no response to your challenge! Perhaps folks just don't know or they are wary of how you presented it.

I'm going to take you at your word that this is a sword, implying that it is of a functional length and constructed such that it could be used in a sword fight. (I'll return to this assumption later). I don't recall having seen a closely similar "dha" before, and I agree that it is very unusual for a SE Asian sword.

Starting with the blade. The rather flat, curved end is uncommon but I have an old Thai sword/machete that has a similarly shaped tip. Otherwise I don't recall another example quite like this one. The blade has a wide fuller that stops short of being the full length of the blade. When I see such a fuller, I think of a Burmese dha. Fullers are also found on some southern Yunnan swords (e.g., Hu Sa dao) and some used by the Jingpo/Kachin in northern Burma and adjacent Yunnan. Without dimensions, we don't know the thickness of the spine. The blade looks to have some age, although it has been cleaned which makes an age estimate more difficult. I don't see a laminated pattern to it.

The hilt is wood with a brass(?) ferrule. The hilt is relatively long, longer than usually seen on Burmese swords, and consistent with hilt/blade proportions found on Thai, Lao, and Montagnard swords. The wood hilt is a dark variety and also seems to have some age. The pommel may be a plain representation of a lotus bud, such as seen on many dha/daab, etc. The cylindrical hilt does not seem to have had anything covering the polished wood, such as plaited rattan rings, and may have presented some difficulty holding the sword when wet. There is no disc guard.

The scabbard is very plain and simple: wood with brass (?) bands at the throat and toe, with similar bands encircling the scabbard at intervals. Nothing very distinctive.

The fullered blade points to a Burmese influence, while the hilt seems too long for a Burmese sword. The longish hilt suggests Thai/Lao origins, perhaps Montagnard, or even Shan. I am concerned about whether the hilt was intended for combat use, given the uncertain grip that the polished wood would offer.

Returning to the assumption that this is a sword-length piece. Iain has been cagey about the dimensions of this item, not wishing to disclose them and "give the game away." Perhaps the dimensions are not those of a regular sword, but one which is smaller or larger than usual. As I look at the last picture, which includes a Buddhist statue and the sword, I wonder whether the statue is one of those small gilded ones, about 4-6 inches in height. If so, then the blade would be no more than 10-12 inches in length. The statue would need to be much bigger (12 inches or more) for this sword to be a useful size in a sword fight. Of course, Iain may have photoshopped two images, one of the statue and the other of the sword and scabbard, and the two have no relationship in terms of size.

Time for some more information Iain.

18th June 2024, 12:12 PM	#3
Ian Vikingsword Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: The Aussie Bush Posts: 4,333	Hi Iain, Three days, about 230 views, and no response to your challenge! Perhaps folks just don't know or they are wary of how you presented it. I'm going to take you at your word that this is a sword, implying that it is of a functional length and constructed such that it could be used in a sword fight. (I'll return to this assumption later). I don't recall having seen a closely similar "dha" before, and I agree that it is very unusual for a SE Asian sword. Starting with the blade. The rather flat, curved end is uncommon but I have an old Thai sword/machete that has a similarly shaped tip. Otherwise I don't recall another example quite like this one. The blade has a wide fuller that stops short of being the full length of the blade. When I see such a fuller, I think of a Burmese dha. Fullers are also found on some southern Yunnan swords (e.g., Hu Sa dao) and some used by the Jingpo/Kachin in northern Burma and adjacent Yunnan. Without dimensions, we don't know the thickness of the spine. The blade looks to have some age, although it has been cleaned which makes an age estimate more difficult. I don't see a laminated pattern to it. The hilt is wood with a brass(?) ferrule. The hilt is relatively long, longer than usually seen on Burmese swords, and consistent with hilt/blade proportions found on Thai, Lao, and Montagnard swords. The wood hilt is a dark variety and also seems to have some age. The pommel may be a plain representation of a lotus bud, such as seen on many dha/daab, etc. The cylindrical hilt does not seem to have had anything covering the polished wood, such as plaited rattan rings, and may have presented some difficulty holding the sword when wet. There is no disc guard. The scabbard is very plain and simple: wood with brass (?) bands at the throat and toe, with similar bands encircling the scabbard at intervals. Nothing very distinctive. The fullered blade points to a Burmese influence, while the hilt seems too long for a Burmese sword. The longish hilt suggests Thai/Lao origins, perhaps Montagnard, or even Shan. I am concerned about whether the hilt was intended for combat use, given the uncertain grip that the polished wood would offer. Returning to the assumption that this is a sword-length piece. Iain has been cagey about the dimensions of this item, not wishing to disclose them and "give the game away." Perhaps the dimensions are not those of a regular sword, but one which is smaller or larger than usual. As I look at the last picture, which includes a Buddhist statue and the sword, I wonder whether the statue is one of those small gilded ones, about 4-6 inches in height. If so, then the blade would be no more than 10-12 inches in length. The statue would need to be much bigger (12 inches or more) for this sword to be a useful size in a sword fight. Of course, Iain may have photoshopped two images, one of the statue and the other of the sword and scabbard, and the two have no relationship in terms of size. Time for some more information Iain.