Ethnographic Arms & Armour

Ethnographic Arms & Armour (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/index.php)
-   Ethnographic Weapons (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=2)
-   -   Combination of katar and two percussion pistols (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=30824)

Ian 26th July 2025 03:41 PM

Combination of katar and two percussion pistols
 
2 Attachment(s)
This item recently finished at auction. Mid-19th C would be my guess on age. An unusual pairing.
.

Jim McDougall 26th July 2025 04:47 PM

Very interesting Ian!! The innovation of Indian armorers is truly fascinating and in the 19th century when the durbars of the Raj became great events that became akin to todays 'gun shows' on the periphery...these guys always tried to impress .
The dual gun actions are percussion, suggesting probably 1840s, but unusual seeing them paired. Flintlock gun actions are well known on hunting swords of 18th century, and the gun production innovations did not escape armorers trying to impress the dignitaries in the princely states.

"Firearms Curiosa", Lewis Winant, 1955, is a good read pertaining to these kinds of unusual weapons.

Thanks for sharing this Ian.....I hope my response doesnt 'kill the thread'.

Tim Simmons 26th July 2025 07:47 PM

Curious about the rough finish. Also the pracitcality. I wonder if is a 19th centruy curio so to speak.

Jim McDougall 26th July 2025 08:04 PM

Good point Tim. This looks pretty rough, and seems like most examples are pretty high end, more for the courts and officials. Apparently Maharaja Raja Ram Singh (1811-1889) was a big fan of combination weapons and BUNDI in Rajasthan a key area for these kinds of weapons.

"Splendors of the Subcontinent: A Princes Tour of India 1875-76" K. Meghani is a good reference for anyone caring to pursue further.

Edster 26th July 2025 08:26 PM

Here's a Youtube that discusses this type of weapon in detail.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FJ_RdKYd5A

Ed

Tim Simmons 26th July 2025 08:47 PM

Although better made I still have doubts this is really a weapon. Just think of carriage pistols. Also how fine real Indian metalwork can be.

Jim McDougall 26th July 2025 10:22 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Kinda like these French 'Apache' revolvers.

Ian 27th July 2025 12:09 AM

Thanks for the responses guys.

I too wonder about the practicality of this item as a weapon. The relatively short blade with only a few inches protruding beyond the pistol muzzles would have had limited penetration for these stabbing weapons. Screw-on barrels and breech loading does not make them very practical pistols either if you needed to reload.

Jim, thanks for the references. Those durbars must have been impressive shows, displaying the manufacturing skills of the various princely states to each other and their subjects.

Jim McDougall 27th July 2025 03:36 AM

I dont know a lot on guns Ian, but those percussion hammers, like the whole setup look pretty weak. When I see these combination weapons I often wonder if they were used, or even intended to be used.

Those durbars from what I have understood were pretty big events bringing together figures and people from many princely states and administrative regions for official business and diplomatic interactions. This attracted many vendors and artisans creating a sort of swap meet type exchange.
I think a lot of the weapons that have come into collecting communities had their origins in these......much like the weapons seen in Egerton (1885).


All times are GMT +1. The time now is 07:20 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2025, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Posts are regarded as being copyrighted by their authors and the act of posting material is deemed to be a granting of an irrevocable nonexclusive license for display here.