Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   help identifying this dagger (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=193)

Montino Bourbon 17th January 2005 04:54 AM

help identifying this dagger
 
1 Attachment(s)
Dear friends; I have had this dagger in my family for a long time; can anyone help me identify it, and give a possible provenance?
Thank you!

Federico 17th January 2005 06:38 AM

A very interesting dagger. Can you identify the handle material, horn, wood, etc...? Is the brass ferrule brazed (eg. can you see a seam), or is it one piece? Any more on its history in your family?

Montino Bourbon 17th January 2005 07:34 AM

The handle seems to be alternating rings of material; I don't know what it is, although tomorrow I will post a close-up of it. there are layers of different colors of material, with very thin metal between them, and the whole handle is fluted. I can't tell how the ferrule is attached. The dagger has been in my family since I was little, more than 60 years; it's possible that it has been in the family a long time. My family is a very old Italian family; on my father's side we trace our ancestry back to 907 C.E. for our present last name, (I have the family archives in my possession, but we are well known historically in Italy), farther if you go back to Roman times, and I have been told that we have Etruscan ancestry as well. It seems to be really nice steel, with an excellent armor-piercing point.

Montino Bourbon 17th January 2005 07:38 AM

I just examined the ferrule closely; it does not look like it has a seam. I'll post more pics tomorrow.

Rich 17th January 2005 10:18 AM

I think this is a style called a Mediterranian dagger.
Likely from southern Europe, French, Spain or Italy.
The style was around a long time, ca 1500 - 1900.
Hard to guess a date, but a nice looking piece.

Rich S

Yannis 17th January 2005 10:58 AM

It is mediteranian dagger. Italian, late 18th century, according to "Weapons" (The Diagram Group) encyclopedia, page 33.

RSWORD 17th January 2005 01:30 PM

Thank you for posting such a lovely knife. I really like the workmanship of the blade. It appears to be quite well made.

tom hyle 17th January 2005 02:12 PM

Beautiful, and correctly identified. I'll add that it is fairly likely though by no means certain to have been locally produced. The sculptural detail on the blade is sometimes used as a thumb-rest.

Montino Bourbon 17th January 2005 04:10 PM

1 Attachment(s)
You gentlemen are terrific! I hope that I can be as helpful to you when I get the chance.

Here is a close-up of the handle; I suspect that this dagger has been with my family for a while, since I doubt that my father or grandfather would have purchased such an object.

wolviex 17th January 2005 06:39 PM

Oh, how nice to see some European arms on this forum from time to time :) . It is Mediterranian knife indeed, it's seems to be very popular in Italy. Try to explore some Italian arms & armour auctions and I think you'll find plenty of similiar weapons (in the past I saw on Czerny's auctions few of them).
Yannis: are you sure this is end of the 18th century? Can I shyly suggest mid 19th century? It's not expert thought, just a feeling when you look at the sheath, at brass fitings, etc.
By the way, aren't similiar knives mostly seen without scabbards nowadays? Anyway very interesting object, and thank you for sharing with us with this piece of European history :D

PS. Congratulation long history of your family, I love genealogy, but somehow I'm happy my familiy roots riching "only" to 14th century :D

tom hyle 18th January 2005 12:57 AM

Looks like lead spacers in the horn handle, as common on Somali billao.

Yannis 18th January 2005 01:16 AM

wolviex

You are right, scabbard is looking more 19th century but I was intentified the dagger by the book I mention before. As we know scabards were change often. Also as Rich notice this form of dagger was in fashion for 4 centuries.

But what a perfect dagger! And as a family heritage it is priceless.

Montino: If I was you I could not trade this dagger for nothing. Enjoy it


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