Ethnographic Arms & Armour

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-   -   Antique spring assist/gravity wrist daggers (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=11088)

Atlantia 19th November 2009 08:22 PM

Antique spring assist/gravity wrist daggers
 
Of the up the sleeve attached to your arm type....
I've often wondered if there is any historical precedent for these in reality?

4:20 in this clip
Kroenen

25 seconds in on this one
Laurence Olvier in Marathon man

55 seconds
Assasins Creed

fearn 19th November 2009 09:13 PM

I think the Marathon Man clip shows what the problem is :D

Seriously, it looks concealable, but you've got to figure out some sort of trigger that's also inconspicuous, and then keep the whole thing on your arm without accidentally triggering it. It's easier to simply hide a knife in a sheath somewhere.

I've seen pics of guns and dart throwers in that configuration, but offhand I don't know of a real implementation of it anywhere.

Best,

F

Atlantia 19th November 2009 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearn
I think the Marathon Man clip shows what the problem is :D

Seriously, it looks concealable, but you've got to figure out some sort of trigger that's also inconspicuous, and then keep the whole thing on your arm without accidentally triggering it. It's easier to simply hide a knife in a sheath somewhere.

I've seen pics of guns and dart throwers in that configuration, but offhand I don't know of a real implementation of it anywhere.

Best,

F


Well, I dont think there is any doubt that small guns have had 'up the arm' rigs made for them. I think the 'flick' method employed in Taxi Driver using the carriage from a typewriter is the best! Check youtube for more...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2XZWi...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Jamg3FRHfE

personal fav's
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fNZR9...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8opY0LeMRoI

fearn 20th November 2009 06:44 PM

In case I was confusing, I meant an up-the-arm knife, following the question.

Thinking about it, I do know a story of a Chinese martial arts master who could reportedly throw a knife out of a wrist sheath. That definitely qualifies as a neat trick in my book, but it's not quite what you're looking for.

Best,

F

Rick 20th November 2009 07:01 PM

Ballistic
 
Is this what you mean ?
A antique version ?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ballistic_knife

josh stout 24th November 2009 11:37 PM

I once asked Scott Rodell about the brass spring loaded wrist darts from China that one occasionally sees on eBay, and he said that, while he was skeptical about the ones for sale, they were based on a real weapon. Chinese throwing knives, needles etc. are pretty rare, though they are well documented in martial arts styles and period novels. The wrist dart holders look like brass tubes around eight inches long and shoot needles like short fat knitting needles. The dart is spring loaded. There is a groove going around near the tip of the dart and this slots into a small release mechanism that can be depressed with a finger.

I can't think of any similar arrangement where a fixed blade sprang out like that. There were double and single knives or even small maces that were traditionally hidden up a sleeve, but nothing fixed. The Chinese like to be able to spin their knives around.
Josh

Atlantia 25th November 2009 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josh stout
I once asked Scott Rodell about the brass spring loaded wrist darts from China that one occasionally sees on eBay, and he said that, while he was skeptical about the ones for sale, they were based on a real weapon. Chinese throwing knives, needles etc. are pretty rare, though they are well documented in martial arts styles and period novels. The wrist dart holders look like brass tubes around eight inches long and shoot needles like short fat knitting needles. The dart is spring loaded. There is a groove going around near the tip of the dart and this slots into a small release mechanism that can be depressed with a finger.

I can't think of any similar arrangement where a fixed blade sprang out like that. There were double and single knives or even small maces that were traditionally hidden up a sleeve, but nothing fixed. The Chinese like to be able to spin their knives around.
Josh

Ah I like it! Never seen one before, interesting 'dinky toy firing missile' principal of manufacture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYOlI...eature=related

Might be fun to make one.........

fearn 26th November 2009 04:36 AM

And, of course, the Turkana didn't wear sleeves over these. :D:D:D

josh stout 29th November 2009 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlantia
Ah I like it! Never seen one before, interesting 'dinky toy firing missile' principal of manufacture.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hYOlI...eature=related

Might be fun to make one.........

Wow, you found one. That looks pretty typical of the ones I have seen pictures of. I wonder how old it is? I see things that make me think it has some age, and things like the slot cut into the side that look recent.

Notice how thick the spring seems. It looks like it had some power.
Josh

Atlantia 29th November 2009 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fearn
And, of course, the Turkana didn't wear sleeves over these. :D:D:D

LOL, true enough!

Atlantia 29th November 2009 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by josh stout
Wow, you found one. That looks pretty typical of the ones I have seen pictures of. I wonder how old it is? I see things that make me think it has some age, and things like the slot cut into the side that look recent.

Notice how thick the spring seems. It looks like it had some power.
Josh


The spring looks like its out of a cheap chinese air-gun. I think it would be fairly easy to make something along these lines.
Be fun to try!

ariel 30th November 2009 07:31 AM

Aren't they against the law?

Rick 30th November 2009 10:04 PM

Very .

ericlaude 30th January 2010 11:53 PM

sleeve dart
 
5 Attachment(s)
Hello, just for show you the chinese sleeve dart.
First, the spring tube mounted as a gun, and the original spring tube with its dart.

Atlantia 31st January 2010 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericlaude
Hello, just for show you the chinese sleeve dart.
First, the spring tube mounted as a gun, and the original spring tube with its dart.

OMG that is beautiful!
Is it yours Ericlaude?
Can you tell me anything more about it?

Wow, I really want one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :eek:

ericlaude 31st January 2010 05:50 PM

dart gun
 
Hello Atlantia and thanks,
Yes it's mine, I trade its to a French dealer, I haven't much information on its historia, It's chinese behind 1870 - 1900 .

Atlantia 31st January 2010 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericlaude
Hello Atlantia and thanks,
Yes it's mine, I trade its to a French dealer, I haven't much information on its historia, It's chinese behind 1870 - 1900 .

Lucky you, it looks like a lot of fun!!
How do you load it? What is the purpose of the lower tube/rod? Is it a lever to compress the spring?
How does it fire? Accurate?

ericlaude 31st January 2010 06:21 PM

dartgun
 
Both lower tubes are tidying up for 4 darts . The spring is constricted when the tube is closed again and it is locked
by a rotation has right. Power is very big.( traduction with computer)

Atlantia 31st January 2010 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ericlaude
Both lower tubes are tidying up for 4 darts . The spring is constricted when the tube is closed again and it is locked
by a rotation has right. Power is very big.( traduction with computer)

Could we see some pictures of the loading/ firing process?

Best
Gene

ericlaude 31st January 2010 09:39 PM

others pictures
 
6 Attachment(s)
it are not very good but it's easy for understand the mechanism.

ericlaude 31st January 2010 09:40 PM

2 others
 
2 Attachment(s)
for the simple tube

Atlantia 31st January 2010 10:28 PM

Fantastic, thank you so much for posting them. I will very much enjoy studying them :D


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