Very nice hilt Ganja!
I look forward to see the other hilts you acquired from this collection.

Michael

Thank you Pak Jimmy for sharing the beautiful hilt. :)
This head is a 'horse-form' for this one.

.

Just to put in another bit of information, Karsten Sejr Jensen in his Kris disc (chapter 7 pge 10) mentions this about the Kocet-Kocetan hilt form

I dont think it is a praying mantis (mantis religiosa) but the Capricorn beetles are members of the cerambycidae family that Fearn mentioned
David

Very nice warm patina, and good carving too. Gosh, it was posted on 1 Jun and I only saw it today; obviously I haven't been checking the threads often enough these days. :p

One question is - why would the beetle have a horse head?

Yes, the preying mantis seems to be a wrong identification (possibly based on the weird head of some of these hilts).

Could it be just a corruption? Those hilts with the horse-like heads seem to be those with less (or hardly any) beetle-like features.

A wood worker in rural Bali will have been acquainted with the actual beetle as well as the pupae. Those hilts shown by Nieuwenkamp (drawn in 1907) are amazingly accurate... However, the stylized head is already evident in the left example. (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/attach...chmentid=26914)

Maybe this was done to symbolize more than a "mere" animal? Similar to other mythological creatures looking like a human/animal mix (e.g. Hanuman)?

Regards,
Kai

Old thread, resurrected because I am researching the Kocet-Kocetan hilts since I bought 2.

In this catalogue by a terminated auction we read :


https://zeeuwsveilinghuis.nl/blog/ru...nese-dancer-2/


"...Although many ‘experts’ have claimed this special type of handle to represent a mythological horse or eagle (Garuda), W.O.J. Nieuwenkamp (1874-1950) proved –already in 1905!- that we are dealing with a stylized six-legged longhorn beetle (Batocera hector). In Balinese, it is referred to as Kocet Kocetan, derived from the penetrating sound it makes (1). It is said that this insect represents one of the Primordial Animals, Batara Karpa, a beetle whose mother was Dewi Winata, a bird-demon, who was married to Rishi Kasyapa, a tortoise. Three other animal gods were born from this marriage: Batara Garuda, the eagle, Batara Agniya, the marten, and Batara Kowara, the snake. Batara Karpa, or
Kusia, is closely linked to one of the three main gods (Trimurti), Brahma, which in turn implicates that keris with a kocet kocetan handle are only allowed to be worn by Brahmans. Similar to a caterpillar changing into a butterfly, the kocet kocetan is also said to symbolize a youth on the verge of becoming an adult or undergoing an evolution in profession or status ...."

Hello André,

Yes, this hilt type clearly represents the pupa of longhorn beetles. That is the reason why the third pair of legs is partially covered by the (future) wing, at least if carved by someone who knows what he's doing. (BTW, are there any female carvers nowadays or is it still considered a pure male profession/past time?)

Beetles are holometabolic insects which pass through a distinct pupa stage (as butterflies, etc.) even if the metamorphosis is a bit less striking since beetle pupae already exhibit body and appendages similar to adults (cp. the Nieuwenkamp drawing: both hilts resemble the pupa while the adult beetle on the left is different; one has to concede that the carvers exhibit varying talent/knowledge though, especially nowadays we see all sorts of monster versions).

This life stage concept was already alluded to in this discussion and (aside from the Hindu creation narrative) is a really interesting aspect of this hilt type's symbolism, I believe.

Regards,
Kai

An old (Ivory?) Kocet-Kocetan hilt for sharing, it was found intact with a Jalak Budha keris.

Thanks for posting this special hilt, Wijaya!

To me, this looks like an ancestor figural hilt (squatting posture with arms on both sides). Maybe Sumbawa?

Regards,
Kai

I can see a squatting figure but I don't think I can recognise the typical features of a Kocet-Kocetan (at least not the ones that I know as such):confused:

Yes, quite surely not from Bali, I believe.

I'm afraid i'm with Milandro and Kai on this one. More likely an ancestor figure. I don't see any indication it could be an example of a kocet-kocetan hilt and i doubt it is even Balinese.
Doesn't look like ivory either, but better photos might reveal more.

From a 2010 trip to Bali.

Hi everyone, the hilt was recently excavated in the new Kediri airport a few months ago, so It's likely not from Sumbawa or Bali. I was thinking that it might be some kind of prototypical Kocet-Kocetan hilt before it evolved into it's current form.

It is really unlikely that this was a Kocet-Kocetan shape and in fact it is possible that it is the reverse which means that the Kocet-Kocetan evolved in other forms rather than other forms evolved into a Kocet-Kocetan

you can look this up about the evolution of this hilts here

Thanks for the reference, André!

I'm afraid the idea set forth in this paper is a non-sequitur for me: I'm missing an in-depth discussion why the author chooses to associate Madurese hilts with overwhelmingly similar overall features as well as shared motifs/details into 3 distinct categories: H3, Ins3, and I3. I'd like to see convincing evidence why all these Madurese hilts should be considered not more closely related to each other than to 3 very different "lineages" from a variety of cultures.

Regards,
Kai

Thanks for the details, pak Wijaya!

Do you have more pics, please?

So, the whole ensemble is as excavated? (Not including the old scabbard, I guess?)

Regards,
Kai

I cannot see any trace of the Kocet-Kocetan/Kusia form in the hilt shown in post #34, to me it looks like a humanoid form, perhaps generic ancestor figure.

You are right Kai, indeed it isn't clear, it seems as though the author seems to think that the Bali form of hilt making is the truest to the shape that it wants to represent and that the Madura form represents an " evolution" towards abstract form.

Whether this is what really happened it isn't possible to say, certainly not with that brief account given there.

This is my Kocet Kocetan , made of black kerbau horn