Ethnographic Arms & Armour - Keris holder for comment

Ethnographic Arms & Armour (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/index.php)

- Keris Warung Kopi (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/forumdisplay.php?f=11)

- - Keris holder for comment (http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?t=15745)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Atlantia

So what do you think? Mine seems to have all the attributes of Bhima from what I can gather from searching images on google?

Even the snake around his neck.

I'm certain your keris holder is Bima. It is told that the snake around his neck will bite him to death if he ever lied. The reference that you use is Bima, a Sundanese 3 dimensional puppet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

Tunggalametung, I don't think we should use the word "gelung" to describe a warrior's hairstyle. "Gelung" is ngoko for the traditional Javanese women's hairstyle, it is modified by:- gelung kondhe , the everyday style with the bun at the back; gelung boko, which is for ceremonies and special events; gelung supit urang, with a little bun on each side of the head; gelung tekuk, generic for special hairstyles.

Hello Alan, I'm not wayang expert but I'm certain gelung is a valid wayang term. However I check the link that I gave last night and Bayu should use Ketu Dewa (god turban) in Javanese term, not gelung. Jean example is not wayang, and in 3 D object as in statue, I think I remember Balinese depiction on Bayu is without turban (specific to wayang art to differentiate between characters).

Quote:

Originally Posted by A. G. Maisey

No, I'm not a hairdresser. I knew that "gelung" was for women, and when I checked my memory before I posted I found all these other hairstyles.

LOL yes in present day gelung is for woman (and some male rockers, artists, etc for that matter) but in the old days man grows their hair long. So in the old days gelung is a valid term also for man. Gelung may be freely translated as ikat/kuncir but with some sort of fold, so ponytail did not count. Anyway, the term is not generally used outside the contexts you already specified.

Yeah, I guess "gelung" could have been used differently in past times. I've just asked a couple of native speakers of Javanese and their immediate answer was that it could only be used for women, but then when I asked if it could be used for a man if he had long hair, after discussion between themselves they decided that it could be, so since wayang characters have long hair it seems legitimate to use it in that context --- or, as you say, it could be a legit wayang term. I know very little about wayang so I don't have any opinion on this.

Quote:

Originally Posted by tunggulametung

Jean, I think yours could be Bayu, father of Bima.

Chandra, thank you for the tip and I agree that my piece should not depict Bima because of the hairdress. So he could be Bayu, the wind god? :)
Regards

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jean

Chandra, thank you for the tip and I agree that my piece should not depict Bima because of the hairdress. Could he be Bayu, the wind god? :)
Regards

You're welcome Jean. Yes Bayu/Vayu, the lord of wind, in wayang art he is often depicted with pancanaka thumbnail. Remember we have Bayu and Bima as keris hilt as well :)

I quote this from wikipedia: Like the other atmospheric deities, he is a "fighter and destroyer", "powerful and heroic."[5]

Gene, I took this photo from Ensiklopedi Keris book. Same character but different style (more comical). I hope it is useful for future reference ;)